1 00:00:19,939 --> 00:00:17,000 or back oh my gosh hello hello and 2 00:00:22,929 --> 00:00:19,949 welcome to the first Hubble hang out of 3 00:00:26,420 --> 00:00:22,939 2016 and it begins auspicious Lorraine 4 00:00:28,750 --> 00:00:26,430 initially a telephone call the instant 5 00:00:31,070 --> 00:00:28,760 we had started broadcast thats hilarious 6 00:00:33,020 --> 00:00:31,080 anyway my name is Tony Darnell and I'm 7 00:00:34,670 --> 00:00:33,030 really excited to be back doing these 8 00:00:36,620 --> 00:00:34,680 hangouts for this year we've got a lot 9 00:00:38,900 --> 00:00:36,630 of great hangouts plan for you and in 10 00:00:40,880 --> 00:00:38,910 fact today in particular we're going to 11 00:00:43,280 --> 00:00:40,890 be talking about galaxy clusters in the 12 00:00:46,130 --> 00:00:43,290 early universe because astronomers using 13 00:00:48,170 --> 00:00:46,140 three of NASA's great observatories the 14 00:00:49,850 --> 00:00:48,180 Hubble Space Telescope the Chandra x-ray 15 00:00:52,369 --> 00:00:49,860 telescope and the Spitzer Space 16 00:00:55,369 --> 00:00:52,379 Telescope along with the Keck 17 00:00:58,160 --> 00:00:55,379 Observatory in Hawaii have been looking 18 00:01:01,250 --> 00:00:58,170 at a have found one of the earliest and 19 00:01:03,529 --> 00:01:01,260 most massive galaxy clusters ever seen 20 00:01:05,390 --> 00:01:03,539 and we're going to talk about why that 21 00:01:07,640 --> 00:01:05,400 is important and we're going to put that 22 00:01:09,850 --> 00:01:07,650 in perspective for you with my with the 23 00:01:12,200 --> 00:01:09,860 help of my friends and colleagues 24 00:01:13,700 --> 00:01:12,210 joining me again this year dr. carol 25 00:01:16,399 --> 00:01:13,710 christian she's the Hubble Space 26 00:01:18,140 --> 00:01:16,409 Telescope outreach scientist and Scott 27 00:01:21,170 --> 00:01:18,150 Lewis is also here with us to help us 28 00:01:23,450 --> 00:01:21,180 just bring us back to earth and get the 29 00:01:26,060 --> 00:01:23,460 and tell us what's going on with the 30 00:01:27,770 --> 00:01:26,070 levity in this conversation yeah yeah 31 00:01:32,810 --> 00:01:27,780 yeah you might even be way out there I 32 00:01:34,399 --> 00:01:32,820 got ya the welcome back guy is a happy 33 00:01:36,319 --> 00:01:34,409 new year and all that kind of girl I 34 00:01:42,020 --> 00:01:36,329 mean it's good to be back doing these 35 00:01:43,850 --> 00:01:42,030 again um the UH the I guess usually this 36 00:01:45,289 --> 00:01:43,860 time of the the hangout we have some 37 00:01:46,429 --> 00:01:45,299 announcements but I don't really have 38 00:01:48,410 --> 00:01:46,439 any Carol do you have anything you'd 39 00:01:51,380 --> 00:01:48,420 like to point out anybody what's for 40 00:01:52,910 --> 00:01:51,390 just that James Webb telescope is doing 41 00:01:55,609 --> 00:01:52,920 really well and searching all the 42 00:01:58,870 --> 00:01:55,619 mirrors so let's come along we had a 43 00:02:03,530 --> 00:01:58,880 great american astronomical society 44 00:02:06,020 --> 00:02:03,540 meeting last week where results were 45 00:02:08,719 --> 00:02:06,030 presented in including this one right 46 00:02:11,360 --> 00:02:08,729 and that's right it was presented at the 47 00:02:13,369 --> 00:02:11,370 double-a s last week it was a lot there 48 00:02:13,820 --> 00:02:13,379 there were a lot of interesting results 49 00:02:17,720 --> 00:02:13,830 that 50 00:02:21,410 --> 00:02:17,730 came out and Hubble's doing well and 51 00:02:23,750 --> 00:02:21,420 we're off to a new cycle of proposals so 52 00:02:26,570 --> 00:02:23,760 we'll get to ask people oh are you going 53 00:02:29,870 --> 00:02:26,580 to propose for this in cycle 24 problem 54 00:02:31,400 --> 00:02:29,880 that's right now is the season it begins 55 00:02:33,980 --> 00:02:31,410 the season of asking for Hubble time 56 00:02:38,420 --> 00:02:33,990 isn't that right yeah that's right cool 57 00:02:40,160 --> 00:02:38,430 all right well uh so the so before we 58 00:02:41,360 --> 00:02:40,170 want to introduce my guest but before I 59 00:02:44,390 --> 00:02:41,370 get started I'm going to have Scott 60 00:02:45,710 --> 00:02:44,400 Lewis tell you guys how we'd like to get 61 00:02:47,210 --> 00:02:45,720 your questions and comments throughout 62 00:02:49,910 --> 00:02:47,220 the Hangout so we hope you'll engage 63 00:02:52,100 --> 00:02:49,920 with us and ask questions Scott tell 64 00:02:53,750 --> 00:02:52,110 people how they can do that alright so 65 00:02:55,010 --> 00:02:53,760 the the best and easiest way for you to 66 00:02:56,630 --> 00:02:55,020 get in touch with us while we're live 67 00:02:58,850 --> 00:02:56,640 since you're watching the streams on the 68 00:03:00,590 --> 00:02:58,860 very bottom left o be some texture that 69 00:03:03,380 --> 00:03:00,600 says that we're answering questions and 70 00:03:05,330 --> 00:03:03,390 we are it opens up to Q&A and it allows 71 00:03:07,760 --> 00:03:05,340 you to watch us and on the right hand 72 00:03:09,290 --> 00:03:07,770 side you'll have some you'll have a 73 00:03:10,760 --> 00:03:09,300 little menu in there where you can type 74 00:03:12,710 --> 00:03:10,770 in questions you can upload other 75 00:03:15,110 --> 00:03:12,720 questions too and so when we're going to 76 00:03:16,580 --> 00:03:15,120 our Q&A time we can actually select it 77 00:03:18,259 --> 00:03:16,590 and i'll actually notify you that we're 78 00:03:20,509 --> 00:03:18,269 answering those questions so that's a 79 00:03:22,880 --> 00:03:20,519 really really good way to engage with us 80 00:03:24,800 --> 00:03:22,890 while we're live broadcasting the other 81 00:03:26,570 --> 00:03:24,810 best way for you to get in touch with us 82 00:03:29,270 --> 00:03:26,580 is grover on Twitter so we are live 83 00:03:32,030 --> 00:03:29,280 tweeting right now as at Hubble 84 00:03:33,920 --> 00:03:32,040 telescope using the hashtag Hubble hang 85 00:03:35,870 --> 00:03:33,930 out so i'll be live tweeting as we're 86 00:03:38,180 --> 00:03:35,880 going on so if you have any questions or 87 00:03:39,860 --> 00:03:38,190 interesting insights I please use that 88 00:03:41,960 --> 00:03:39,870 hashtag and I'll be going back and forth 89 00:03:45,380 --> 00:03:41,970 with their i also have an event open on 90 00:03:46,820 --> 00:03:45,390 facebook and and we can check the 91 00:03:48,259 --> 00:03:46,830 regular YouTube comments as well so 92 00:03:49,370 --> 00:03:48,269 we'll be checking all over the place for 93 00:03:52,040 --> 00:03:49,380 any of the comments you have but the 94 00:03:53,990 --> 00:03:52,050 best way is using the Q&A app or using 95 00:03:56,240 --> 00:03:54,000 Twitter that's how we'll get in touch 96 00:03:57,110 --> 00:03:56,250 with you Oh some thank you so we look 97 00:03:59,240 --> 00:03:57,120 forward to your comments and questions 98 00:04:00,890 --> 00:03:59,250 and we'll read them as we go along or 99 00:04:02,930 --> 00:04:00,900 we'll have some time on set aside at the 100 00:04:04,640 --> 00:04:02,940 end to also read them out so we look 101 00:04:08,180 --> 00:04:04,650 forward to that so let me get to today's 102 00:04:10,160 --> 00:04:08,190 hangout as I said three of NASA's great 103 00:04:11,810 --> 00:04:10,170 observers how many are there Carol how 104 00:04:15,470 --> 00:04:11,820 many great observatories are there any 105 00:04:19,759 --> 00:04:15,480 way I'd other more than 3 billions and 106 00:04:22,010 --> 00:04:19,769 billions now after all right you know 107 00:04:25,219 --> 00:04:22,020 because nowadays the NASA has set these 108 00:04:27,590 --> 00:04:25,229 aside specifically as a yes the 109 00:04:31,730 --> 00:04:27,600 gamma-ray observatory was a grade of 110 00:04:34,730 --> 00:04:31,740 ritory Oh bit Spitzer which is infrared 111 00:04:37,610 --> 00:04:34,740 Hubble which is UV optical infrared and 112 00:04:40,670 --> 00:04:37,620 Chandra which is the x-ray Observatory 113 00:04:43,880 --> 00:04:40,680 so the bar be good they're not great or 114 00:04:47,390 --> 00:04:43,890 they swell are they danamon turns yeah 115 00:04:52,850 --> 00:04:47,400 pretty good you know awesome but yeah 116 00:04:58,220 --> 00:04:52,860 yeah they're just not great okay so well 117 00:05:01,930 --> 00:04:58,230 good so colleagues out there yeah yeah 118 00:05:06,500 --> 00:05:01,940 mom it's 2016 and work grumpy okay hey 119 00:05:07,730 --> 00:05:06,510 NASA Colton gray right okay so so a lot 120 00:05:09,080 --> 00:05:07,740 of a lot of wavelengths a lot of 121 00:05:10,910 --> 00:05:09,090 eyeballs were brought to bear on this 122 00:05:12,080 --> 00:05:10,920 particular set of observations so let's 123 00:05:14,930 --> 00:05:12,090 get to them but let me introduce our 124 00:05:17,270 --> 00:05:14,940 guests joining me is the the lead author 125 00:05:20,210 --> 00:05:17,280 on the on the paper dr. mark broad when 126 00:05:22,400 --> 00:05:20,220 he is a US and is an assistant professor 127 00:05:24,370 --> 00:05:22,410 at MIT he's also a member of the 128 00:05:28,790 --> 00:05:24,380 Cavalier for astrophysics and space 129 00:05:31,210 --> 00:05:28,800 research also dr. Anthony Gonzales he's 130 00:05:33,920 --> 00:05:31,220 a professor at the University of Florida 131 00:05:37,070 --> 00:05:33,930 very near where I'm at my where my home 132 00:05:40,070 --> 00:05:37,080 is actually also dr. Mike McDonald from 133 00:05:41,990 --> 00:05:40,080 from oh wait a minute did I get I got a 134 00:05:44,810 --> 00:05:42,000 backwards in my fraud when is university 135 00:05:46,640 --> 00:05:44,820 of missouri at kansas sorry about that I 136 00:05:48,440 --> 00:05:46,650 apologize he's at the university of 137 00:05:50,450 --> 00:05:48,450 missouri at kansas it's mike mcdonald 138 00:05:52,940 --> 00:05:50,460 who's from MIT an assistant professor a 139 00:05:54,200 --> 00:05:52,950 member or and a member of the MIT my 140 00:05:57,080 --> 00:05:54,210 teas carefully Center for Astrophysics 141 00:05:58,850 --> 00:05:57,090 based research here to talk about all 142 00:06:00,800 --> 00:05:58,860 these things so welcome to our hangout 143 00:06:02,920 --> 00:06:00,810 guys I'm glad we didn't scare you off 144 00:06:06,020 --> 00:06:02,930 and after we got through all of the 145 00:06:07,490 --> 00:06:06,030 initial browser difficulties we're back 146 00:06:09,200 --> 00:06:07,500 on track so let's talk about this a 147 00:06:13,310 --> 00:06:09,210 let's talk about this mark I'm going to 148 00:06:15,560 --> 00:06:13,320 start with you so you guys obviously got 149 00:06:19,970 --> 00:06:15,570 a lot of telescope time here to do this 150 00:06:21,890 --> 00:06:19,980 but the the you you guys have found not 151 00:06:27,350 --> 00:06:21,900 just found but you've characterized and 152 00:06:29,660 --> 00:06:27,360 measured the mass of one of the largest 153 00:06:32,570 --> 00:06:29,670 galaxy clusters in the early universe 154 00:06:33,950 --> 00:06:32,580 now astronomers you know it takes 155 00:06:35,750 --> 00:06:33,960 hundreds of millions of years for 156 00:06:38,240 --> 00:06:35,760 galaxies to form but even longer for 157 00:06:39,650 --> 00:06:38,250 galaxy clusters to form so I want to 158 00:06:40,999 --> 00:06:39,660 talk a little bit about your work and 159 00:06:42,140 --> 00:06:41,009 what you're doing and 160 00:06:45,679 --> 00:06:42,150 which are going to be presenting to us 161 00:06:47,600 --> 00:06:45,689 today okay thanks Tony yeah this this is 162 00:06:49,249 --> 00:06:47,610 a really exciting cluster that needed 163 00:06:51,679 --> 00:06:49,259 all of NASA's great observatories as 164 00:06:53,959 --> 00:06:51,689 well as some some awesome facilities on 165 00:06:56,420 --> 00:06:53,969 the ground in order to to both find and 166 00:06:59,209 --> 00:06:56,430 characterize we actually found it with 167 00:07:00,739 --> 00:06:59,219 Spitzer in 2012 and as Carol mentioned 168 00:07:03,200 --> 00:07:00,749 Spitzer's an infrared telescope that 169 00:07:04,879 --> 00:07:03,210 lets us see galaxies you know pretty 170 00:07:06,920 --> 00:07:04,889 massive galaxies all the way out in the 171 00:07:09,200 --> 00:07:06,930 universe unlike an optical they don't 172 00:07:11,239 --> 00:07:09,210 really fade so we can find them and you 173 00:07:13,459 --> 00:07:11,249 just God has a copy or Scott has an 174 00:07:14,689 --> 00:07:13,469 image of the 2012 cluster and while 175 00:07:17,899 --> 00:07:14,699 you're talking if he can pull that up 176 00:07:20,749 --> 00:07:17,909 that'd be great okay and so we actually 177 00:07:22,850 --> 00:07:20,759 found this cluster with Spitzer and we 178 00:07:25,159 --> 00:07:22,860 used Hubble back then not just to get 179 00:07:26,510 --> 00:07:25,169 pretty pictures but also to measure the 180 00:07:28,639 --> 00:07:26,520 distance to the cluster Hubble was 181 00:07:30,469 --> 00:07:28,649 actually the key facility in getting 182 00:07:33,219 --> 00:07:30,479 what we call a spectroscopic redshift 183 00:07:35,959 --> 00:07:33,229 although we also used Keck the 10-meter 184 00:07:38,299 --> 00:07:35,969 diameter mirror in Hawaii to help 185 00:07:39,889 --> 00:07:38,309 without that also together we were able 186 00:07:42,260 --> 00:07:39,899 to confirm that the distance is about 10 187 00:07:44,420 --> 00:07:42,270 billion light years away then we turned 188 00:07:46,249 --> 00:07:44,430 our attention to a radio telescope on 189 00:07:48,589 --> 00:07:46,259 the ground that no longer is in 190 00:07:50,510 --> 00:07:48,599 operation sadly but it was called karma 191 00:07:52,989 --> 00:07:50,520 and it allowed us to measure a first 192 00:07:55,219 --> 00:07:52,999 estimate of the mass of the cluster 193 00:07:56,709 --> 00:07:55,229 basically the way that works is if you 194 00:07:58,999 --> 00:07:56,719 look at the Cosmic Microwave Background 195 00:08:00,799 --> 00:07:59,009 when there's a cluster in the way it 196 00:08:02,209 --> 00:08:00,809 looks different the cluster gas affects 197 00:08:04,399 --> 00:08:02,219 the light coming from the cosmic 198 00:08:06,619 --> 00:08:04,409 microwave background and from how much 199 00:08:08,239 --> 00:08:06,629 the spectrum changes we can measure the 200 00:08:10,279 --> 00:08:08,249 mass of the cluster and we did that and 201 00:08:12,139 --> 00:08:10,289 got a mass of something like four 202 00:08:16,059 --> 00:08:12,149 hundred trillion times the mass of our 203 00:08:18,409 --> 00:08:16,069 Sun truly with a tea with a tea yeah Wow 204 00:08:19,730 --> 00:08:18,419 okay now let me make sure I understood 205 00:08:21,110 --> 00:08:19,740 what you just said so you said you 206 00:08:24,139 --> 00:08:21,120 looked at this with karma and radio 207 00:08:25,969 --> 00:08:24,149 waves rant based on the amount of 208 00:08:27,799 --> 00:08:25,979 distortion in the Cosmic Microwave 209 00:08:29,689 --> 00:08:27,809 Background in that wavelength you were 210 00:08:33,379 --> 00:08:29,699 able to get an idea how massive it was 211 00:08:34,459 --> 00:08:33,389 that's right yeah the basically the the 212 00:08:37,009 --> 00:08:34,469 photons from the Cosmic Microwave 213 00:08:38,930 --> 00:08:37,019 Background hit are they scatter they hit 214 00:08:41,629 --> 00:08:38,940 the electrons in the cluster and they 215 00:08:43,639 --> 00:08:41,639 change what the CMB looks like in fact 216 00:08:45,319 --> 00:08:43,649 at you the same be kind of disappears a 217 00:08:46,670 --> 00:08:45,329 little bit at the right if you look in 218 00:08:49,250 --> 00:08:46,680 the right frequency so you're kind of 219 00:08:51,199 --> 00:08:49,260 looking for holes in the sky and the 220 00:08:53,780 --> 00:08:51,209 deeper the whole the greater the mass of 221 00:08:54,680 --> 00:08:53,790 the cluster so those observations back 222 00:08:58,130 --> 00:08:54,690 in 2012 223 00:09:00,050 --> 00:08:58,140 kind of set the stage then for knowing 224 00:09:02,600 --> 00:09:00,060 that this was something very massive and 225 00:09:05,510 --> 00:09:02,610 very very far away correct yeah exactly 226 00:09:08,000 --> 00:09:05,520 and and the logical thing to do next was 227 00:09:09,950 --> 00:09:08,010 to try and get Shandra time shaundra's 228 00:09:11,900 --> 00:09:09,960 the premier facility for studying galaxy 229 00:09:14,390 --> 00:09:11,910 clusters in the x-ray and why was that 230 00:09:16,520 --> 00:09:14,400 why was that the logical next step why 231 00:09:19,730 --> 00:09:16,530 did you go from from radio all the way 232 00:09:22,310 --> 00:09:19,740 to x-ray it is a long way to go that's 233 00:09:24,910 --> 00:09:22,320 right as far as you can go but the 234 00:09:26,960 --> 00:09:24,920 reason is because the Chandra is the 235 00:09:29,210 --> 00:09:26,970 facility that's best able to 236 00:09:31,630 --> 00:09:29,220 characterize galaxy clusters all aspects 237 00:09:33,800 --> 00:09:31,640 of galaxy clusters and so that's when 238 00:09:35,900 --> 00:09:33,810 professor McDonald got involved I 239 00:09:37,550 --> 00:09:35,910 actually wrote the proposal but he did a 240 00:09:40,880 --> 00:09:37,560 lot of the analysis on the extra David 241 00:09:42,440 --> 00:09:40,890 he can speak to that okay Michael so you 242 00:09:43,790 --> 00:09:42,450 want to talk a little bit about some of 243 00:09:45,670 --> 00:09:43,800 the some of the x-ray data that you took 244 00:09:48,860 --> 00:09:45,680 from this image or from this cluster 245 00:09:51,770 --> 00:09:48,870 sure so the the x-ray data it gets a 246 00:09:53,480 --> 00:09:51,780 sense of not only how massive the 247 00:09:55,220 --> 00:09:53,490 cluster is but how that mass is 248 00:09:58,460 --> 00:09:55,230 distributed and sort of where the bulk 249 00:10:00,790 --> 00:09:58,470 of the matter is in the cluster because 250 00:10:04,520 --> 00:10:00,800 the bulk of the matter is in a very hot 251 00:10:07,460 --> 00:10:04,530 diffuse gas phase which is bright x-ray 252 00:10:10,040 --> 00:10:07,470 so Scott has scott has something very 253 00:10:11,780 --> 00:10:10,050 fuzzy and blue up is that what you're 254 00:10:15,620 --> 00:10:11,790 talking about that is exactly what I'm 255 00:10:18,260 --> 00:10:15,630 talking about yeah so this is an x-ray 256 00:10:21,050 --> 00:10:18,270 image of the cluster after we've hit the 257 00:10:23,720 --> 00:10:21,060 enhance button a few times to sort of 258 00:10:25,820 --> 00:10:23,730 improve their data quality but what 259 00:10:28,430 --> 00:10:25,830 you're seeing there is sort of a diffuse 260 00:10:30,830 --> 00:10:28,440 component that's you know a million 261 00:10:33,610 --> 00:10:30,840 light years across and then there's 262 00:10:36,830 --> 00:10:33,620 three peaks two of those Peaks are 263 00:10:39,410 --> 00:10:36,840 active actively creating black holes and 264 00:10:41,930 --> 00:10:39,420 the center of the three peaks the center 265 00:10:45,110 --> 00:10:41,940 is it's just the densest part of the ha 266 00:10:47,870 --> 00:10:45,120 Ozma ok so wait every bright spot we see 267 00:10:49,870 --> 00:10:47,880 here the really bright spot is a is a 268 00:10:54,020 --> 00:10:49,880 supermassive black hole in the galaxy 269 00:10:55,520 --> 00:10:54,030 burning so every every spot that we see 270 00:10:57,560 --> 00:10:55,530 here bright spot we see here in this 271 00:11:00,380 --> 00:10:57,570 image that's they the center of a galaxy 272 00:11:02,480 --> 00:11:00,390 or supermassive black hole right so all 273 00:11:05,300 --> 00:11:02,490 the peaks are either the center of the 274 00:11:08,470 --> 00:11:05,310 galaxy or a clump of galaxies but the 275 00:11:10,780 --> 00:11:08,480 diffuse stuff extends over the full 276 00:11:14,350 --> 00:11:10,790 for volume so the cluster the cluster 277 00:11:17,019 --> 00:11:14,360 galaxies are basically in a hot bath at 278 00:11:21,100 --> 00:11:17,029 this path is who's admitting in the next 279 00:11:22,810 --> 00:11:21,110 ways so this gas is by nature of the 280 00:11:26,110 --> 00:11:22,820 fact you're seeing in an x rays is 281 00:11:28,810 --> 00:11:26,120 extremely hot right or at least 282 00:11:30,930 --> 00:11:28,820 energetic correctness and its affiliates 283 00:11:35,439 --> 00:11:30,940 of degrees or millions of degrees thirty 284 00:11:37,269 --> 00:11:35,449 and does do all galaxy clusters have 285 00:11:39,730 --> 00:11:37,279 this kind of characters to gas I mean 286 00:11:40,840 --> 00:11:39,740 are they or is it just is this one I'm 287 00:11:44,319 --> 00:11:40,850 trying to I'm trying to get a sense of 288 00:11:46,120 --> 00:11:44,329 it is this special too early galaxy 289 00:11:48,280 --> 00:11:46,130 clusters or do all galaxy clusters know 290 00:11:50,920 --> 00:11:48,290 so so in fact the temperature of the gas 291 00:11:52,870 --> 00:11:50,930 tells us something about the mass or it 292 00:11:56,439 --> 00:11:52,880 tells us a lot about the mass so as you 293 00:11:58,600 --> 00:11:56,449 compressed gas it gets hotter and so the 294 00:12:00,910 --> 00:11:58,610 more mass you have that's pushing the 295 00:12:03,639 --> 00:12:00,920 cluster down and compressing it in the 296 00:12:05,110 --> 00:12:03,649 center the hotter the gas will be so by 297 00:12:08,860 --> 00:12:05,120 measuring the temperature of these 298 00:12:10,629 --> 00:12:08,870 x-rays we get a sense of how much matter 299 00:12:12,730 --> 00:12:10,639 is is sort of pulling in on the cluster 300 00:12:15,040 --> 00:12:12,740 that gives us a estimate of the total 301 00:12:18,610 --> 00:12:15,050 mass which is much more accurate than 302 00:12:20,410 --> 00:12:18,620 the radio s okay so that's why it was 303 00:12:22,059 --> 00:12:20,420 the next logical step to go from Radio 304 00:12:25,449 --> 00:12:22,069 to x-rays to get a bit more accurate 305 00:12:28,480 --> 00:12:25,459 mass then right okay alright so these 306 00:12:32,280 --> 00:12:28,490 also you have a question so why why do 307 00:12:35,590 --> 00:12:32,290 these galaxies clusters have like a 308 00:12:39,610 --> 00:12:35,600 regular mass that we can see presumably 309 00:12:41,470 --> 00:12:39,620 there's dark matter and then it has this 310 00:12:45,879 --> 00:12:41,480 hot gas what's the relationship between 311 00:12:48,280 --> 00:12:45,889 the hot gas and the galaxy galaxies we 312 00:12:50,439 --> 00:12:48,290 see which will we'll see later on and 313 00:12:54,400 --> 00:12:50,449 images that were taken by Hubble and 314 00:12:58,150 --> 00:12:54,410 Spitzer so most of this hot gas was 315 00:13:00,129 --> 00:12:58,160 probably once in galaxies and it's been 316 00:13:02,379 --> 00:13:00,139 either stripped as the galaxies fall 317 00:13:05,350 --> 00:13:02,389 into the cluster or it's been expelled 318 00:13:08,470 --> 00:13:05,360 by things like supernova or active 319 00:13:11,949 --> 00:13:08,480 galaxies so this is the cluster kind of 320 00:13:14,470 --> 00:13:11,959 all shares all of this gas okay end it 321 00:13:18,269 --> 00:13:14,480 but it was probably once a part of the 322 00:13:20,290 --> 00:13:18,279 galaxies that were in the cluster okay 323 00:13:23,070 --> 00:13:20,300 so I just want to comment real quickly 324 00:13:25,720 --> 00:13:23,080 on a something Andrew planet 325 00:13:28,570 --> 00:13:25,730 put on the Q&A app about having problems 326 00:13:31,210 --> 00:13:28,580 with the streaming it sometimes helps if 327 00:13:32,680 --> 00:13:31,220 you just refresh the browser window or 328 00:13:35,170 --> 00:13:32,690 close in the browser window and getting 329 00:13:36,520 --> 00:13:35,180 back to it again sometimes that helps 330 00:13:37,750 --> 00:13:36,530 but that's really your only course of 331 00:13:40,090 --> 00:13:37,760 action I'm sorry you guys are having 332 00:13:42,540 --> 00:13:40,100 trouble while watching the stream 333 00:13:46,390 --> 00:13:42,550 hopefully it'll sort itself out soon 334 00:13:48,130 --> 00:13:46,400 okay so so Anthony I want to get you 335 00:13:51,220 --> 00:13:48,140 involved here a little bit and want to 336 00:13:53,410 --> 00:13:51,230 ask you about the give us a sense of the 337 00:13:55,180 --> 00:13:53,420 timeline here we've already you've 338 00:13:57,460 --> 00:13:55,190 already told us the punchline that this 339 00:14:01,180 --> 00:13:57,470 thing is worth this thing weighs 45 340 00:14:02,680 --> 00:14:01,190 hundred trillion Suns so it's very very 341 00:14:05,170 --> 00:14:02,690 very massive in fact it's the most 342 00:14:08,680 --> 00:14:05,180 massive I think the press release states 343 00:14:11,800 --> 00:14:08,690 a galaxy cluster of this period in the 344 00:14:14,130 --> 00:14:11,810 in the history of the universe but give 345 00:14:16,690 --> 00:14:14,140 us a sense of the timeline so we 346 00:14:19,180 --> 00:14:16,700 presumably we have stars followed by 347 00:14:20,680 --> 00:14:19,190 galaxies followed by clusters of 348 00:14:24,450 --> 00:14:20,690 galaxies right can you give us a sense 349 00:14:26,380 --> 00:14:24,460 of just how long that might take sure so 350 00:14:27,700 --> 00:14:26,390 when you're building a structure in the 351 00:14:29,200 --> 00:14:27,710 universe the smallest things are 352 00:14:32,830 --> 00:14:29,210 building up first so you form the first 353 00:14:34,630 --> 00:14:32,840 stars very early on as soon as matter 354 00:14:37,270 --> 00:14:34,640 starts having a chance to collapse down 355 00:14:39,160 --> 00:14:37,280 enough to that you get structures class 356 00:14:41,470 --> 00:14:39,170 structures and you keep building up 357 00:14:42,910 --> 00:14:41,480 larger and larger things so you get 358 00:14:45,100 --> 00:14:42,920 galaxies forming within the first 359 00:14:47,500 --> 00:14:45,110 billion years after the big bang and 360 00:14:49,630 --> 00:14:47,510 then first billionaire as we're going 361 00:14:51,880 --> 00:14:49,640 with yes within the first billion years 362 00:14:53,230 --> 00:14:51,890 day the first there are these galaxies 363 00:14:55,810 --> 00:14:53,240 we've seen are actually even a bit 364 00:14:56,950 --> 00:14:55,820 further back than that but then you have 365 00:14:59,200 --> 00:14:56,960 to wait while you're building up these 366 00:15:01,950 --> 00:14:59,210 larger and larger structures these 367 00:15:04,360 --> 00:15:01,960 galaxy clusters have as much mass as a 368 00:15:07,360 --> 00:15:04,370 thousand galaxies aside from Milky Way 369 00:15:09,460 --> 00:15:07,370 more or less so and so it's only when 370 00:15:11,500 --> 00:15:09,470 you only you only expect to get its arms 371 00:15:13,210 --> 00:15:11,510 as long as when you're approaching a 372 00:15:16,180 --> 00:15:13,220 little under a mile under happening 373 00:15:19,540 --> 00:15:16,190 already so yes wait another five or six 374 00:15:22,990 --> 00:15:19,550 islands and audio we go but your your 375 00:15:27,310 --> 00:15:23,000 audio just but yeah when my I am yeah 376 00:15:29,470 --> 00:15:27,320 unfortunately it's yet maybe mmm sounds 377 00:15:31,330 --> 00:15:29,480 like you're part cyborg Anthony yeah 378 00:15:32,860 --> 00:15:31,340 yeah I get a lot of things got a lot of 379 00:15:34,450 --> 00:15:32,870 noise in the Indy audio but now you're 380 00:15:35,190 --> 00:15:34,460 better go so I'm sorry go ahead and 381 00:15:37,170 --> 00:15:35,200 continue 382 00:15:39,420 --> 00:15:37,180 oh sure I was just saying that it takes 383 00:15:41,100 --> 00:15:39,430 much longer before galaxy clusters have 384 00:15:42,420 --> 00:15:41,110 time to assemble in form because there's 385 00:15:45,270 --> 00:15:42,430 so much more massive than individual 386 00:15:46,560 --> 00:15:45,280 galaxies and so you don't expect to 387 00:15:47,850 --> 00:15:46,570 start getting galaxy clusters that's 388 00:15:49,650 --> 00:15:47,860 massive until the universe is 389 00:15:52,260 --> 00:15:49,660 approaching roughly half its current age 390 00:15:54,470 --> 00:15:52,270 so when it's getting to be more like six 391 00:15:57,180 --> 00:15:54,480 billion years or seven billion years old 392 00:15:58,740 --> 00:15:57,190 so that's the time skills you formed 393 00:16:00,990 --> 00:15:58,750 start forming the first star is very 394 00:16:02,130 --> 00:16:01,000 quickly the galaxies a bit after that 395 00:16:05,460 --> 00:16:02,140 and then you have to wait a while before 396 00:16:06,750 --> 00:16:05,470 you start seeing these and so at the 397 00:16:09,030 --> 00:16:06,760 distance we're looking at for this 398 00:16:11,060 --> 00:16:09,040 cluster you really at the era where 399 00:16:14,460 --> 00:16:11,070 you're starting to see the very first 400 00:16:17,130 --> 00:16:14,470 cluster is formed so we're really this 401 00:16:18,810 --> 00:16:17,140 is kind of the burthen very early days 402 00:16:22,110 --> 00:16:18,820 or toddler days as it were for cluster 403 00:16:24,930 --> 00:16:22,120 formation ok so I'm sorry I'm going to 404 00:16:26,640 --> 00:16:24,940 comment again on the people having 405 00:16:28,350 --> 00:16:26,650 trouble seeing this dream Scott is there 406 00:16:30,470 --> 00:16:28,360 a way you could post the youtube link on 407 00:16:32,490 --> 00:16:30,480 the comments maybe that will help people 408 00:16:34,590 --> 00:16:32,500 maybe if they go straight to YouTube 409 00:16:36,900 --> 00:16:34,600 they might be able to see it better ok 410 00:16:40,890 --> 00:16:36,910 so don't another bad out there all right 411 00:16:43,410 --> 00:16:40,900 thank you so the so I guess the the 412 00:16:46,980 --> 00:16:43,420 surprise here then with this particular 413 00:16:49,560 --> 00:16:46,990 one is that we is that you saw so you 414 00:16:52,230 --> 00:16:49,570 saw this this particular galaxy cluster 415 00:16:54,120 --> 00:16:52,240 when it was you said universe was was 416 00:16:56,370 --> 00:16:54,130 his 10 billion light years away so the 417 00:16:58,110 --> 00:16:56,380 universe is 13.8 billion years old so 418 00:16:59,970 --> 00:16:58,120 this is about when the universe was 419 00:17:03,630 --> 00:16:59,980 roughly three point eight to four 420 00:17:07,260 --> 00:17:03,640 billion years old correct right so and 421 00:17:09,030 --> 00:17:07,270 how is point the survey that we actually 422 00:17:11,760 --> 00:17:09,040 found this galaxy cluster in was fairly 423 00:17:13,470 --> 00:17:11,770 small in the sky so we elected an area 424 00:17:16,020 --> 00:17:13,480 of about ten square degrees on the sky 425 00:17:18,930 --> 00:17:16,030 which the whole sky is about 42,000 426 00:17:20,579 --> 00:17:18,940 square degrees and you would not have 427 00:17:23,370 --> 00:17:20,589 necessarily expected to find something 428 00:17:26,220 --> 00:17:23,380 this extreme looking in such a small 429 00:17:27,780 --> 00:17:26,230 patch of sky you might expect to find a 430 00:17:31,590 --> 00:17:27,790 few of these across the sky but not 431 00:17:33,180 --> 00:17:31,600 within such a small area so it was a 432 00:17:36,570 --> 00:17:33,190 pleasant surprise that we found this I 433 00:17:41,790 --> 00:17:36,580 think it was fair thing to say okay so 434 00:17:43,350 --> 00:17:41,800 the so the galaxy comes so we use are 435 00:17:47,340 --> 00:17:43,360 you saying this particular cluster then 436 00:17:48,980 --> 00:17:47,350 is is small compared to other other 437 00:17:53,330 --> 00:17:48,990 known galaxy clusters that are older 438 00:17:57,500 --> 00:17:53,340 I so they believe like a small area of 439 00:17:58,880 --> 00:17:57,510 sky it's exceptionally massive it it's 440 00:18:00,650 --> 00:17:58,890 one of the most massive that you would 441 00:18:02,919 --> 00:18:00,660 expect to be out there at this distance 442 00:18:05,090 --> 00:18:02,929 away from us it will grow to something 443 00:18:07,340 --> 00:18:05,100 that will be one of the most massive 444 00:18:08,960 --> 00:18:07,350 clusters in the universe but their real 445 00:18:11,180 --> 00:18:08,970 universe by the time it gets the present 446 00:18:14,660 --> 00:18:11,190 day so it will continue to grow but it's 447 00:18:16,940 --> 00:18:14,670 a very extreme cluster I say okay so we 448 00:18:20,150 --> 00:18:16,950 got so we have so there's our rough 449 00:18:22,130 --> 00:18:20,160 there's roughly our timeline we without 450 00:18:23,960 --> 00:18:22,140 within the first billion years or so the 451 00:18:25,430 --> 00:18:23,970 first stars are the first stars go and 452 00:18:27,049 --> 00:18:25,440 when did you say the first galaxies I'm 453 00:18:28,940 --> 00:18:27,059 sorry because your audio was messed up 454 00:18:30,770 --> 00:18:28,950 then when were the first galaxies came 455 00:18:32,720 --> 00:18:30,780 along a rut for galaxies are within the 456 00:18:35,540 --> 00:18:32,730 first billion years the first stirred in 457 00:18:37,100 --> 00:18:35,550 the first boner yes saying okay you you 458 00:18:39,230 --> 00:18:37,110 form the first stars fairly quickly 459 00:18:40,700 --> 00:18:39,240 after a matter starts having crime to 460 00:18:42,950 --> 00:18:40,710 collapse and you form start forming 461 00:18:45,169 --> 00:18:42,960 galaxies the first galaxies within the 462 00:18:46,850 --> 00:18:45,179 first billion years as well okay so from 463 00:18:49,100 --> 00:18:46,860 what I know about the first stars and 464 00:18:51,169 --> 00:18:49,110 galaxies and what I've learned talking 465 00:18:52,880 --> 00:18:51,179 to people working on things like jwst 466 00:18:54,890 --> 00:18:52,890 and things like this these first stars 467 00:18:57,020 --> 00:18:54,900 and by definition the first galaxies 468 00:18:59,570 --> 00:18:57,030 were pretty strange beasts right i mean 469 00:19:01,280 --> 00:18:59,580 these galaxies that were made up of 470 00:19:03,290 --> 00:19:01,290 stars that were very hot very they 471 00:19:05,510 --> 00:19:03,300 burned out very quickly they died in 472 00:19:08,780 --> 00:19:05,520 core collapse supernovae and they're 473 00:19:10,340 --> 00:19:08,790 very strange massive hot stars and so 474 00:19:12,740 --> 00:19:10,350 bright presumably the galaxies would be 475 00:19:16,490 --> 00:19:12,750 like that is that what the galaxies are 476 00:19:19,180 --> 00:19:16,500 like in this particular cluster are they 477 00:19:22,190 --> 00:19:19,190 they have stars that are reminiscent or 478 00:19:24,530 --> 00:19:22,200 indicative of early stars let me ask let 479 00:19:26,390 --> 00:19:24,540 me ask mark that question no these 480 00:19:28,520 --> 00:19:26,400 you're speaking about a much earlier 481 00:19:31,010 --> 00:19:28,530 time in the universe when stars are 482 00:19:33,290 --> 00:19:31,020 forming from gas that is relatively 483 00:19:35,120 --> 00:19:33,300 pristine also by the time the four 484 00:19:37,250 --> 00:19:35,130 billion years hits for this galaxy 485 00:19:40,280 --> 00:19:37,260 cluster it's we've gone through several 486 00:19:43,040 --> 00:19:40,290 generations well yeah at least one and 487 00:19:44,930 --> 00:19:43,050 and so the the galaxies the stars in 488 00:19:47,390 --> 00:19:44,940 these galaxies are pretty you know 489 00:19:48,650 --> 00:19:47,400 typical stars and the start you know the 490 00:19:50,990 --> 00:19:48,660 star formation activity that's going on 491 00:19:53,299 --> 00:19:51,000 is substantial but it's not appreciably 492 00:19:55,940 --> 00:19:53,309 different than then you know then what's 493 00:20:00,950 --> 00:19:55,950 happening in the local universe okay 494 00:20:01,580 --> 00:20:00,960 that's a very high okay so so the okay 495 00:20:07,970 --> 00:20:01,590 so 496 00:20:11,419 --> 00:20:07,980 Scott's already shown the x-ray the 497 00:20:14,060 --> 00:20:11,429 x-ray version but there's also a sort of 498 00:20:15,169 --> 00:20:14,070 a composite of with Hubble and the 499 00:20:16,970 --> 00:20:15,179 different wavelengths that we're up 500 00:20:18,409 --> 00:20:16,980 there and while Scott if you could put 501 00:20:19,669 --> 00:20:18,419 that up I think it was the press release 502 00:20:22,130 --> 00:20:19,679 image that's what I'm is the one I'm 503 00:20:25,070 --> 00:20:22,140 referring to and then I want to have 504 00:20:28,310 --> 00:20:25,080 maybe Mike remark talk a little bit 505 00:20:29,960 --> 00:20:28,320 about that image here it is so what so 506 00:20:32,210 --> 00:20:29,970 this is what were you guys released last 507 00:20:33,830 --> 00:20:32,220 week correct yeah that's right this was 508 00:20:36,200 --> 00:20:33,840 the press release image that the 509 00:20:38,810 --> 00:20:36,210 accompanied the actual press release and 510 00:20:41,840 --> 00:20:38,820 it's it's really a beautiful image I 511 00:20:45,019 --> 00:20:41,850 think you can see a lot of massive 512 00:20:46,580 --> 00:20:45,029 galaxies the ones that are redder or red 513 00:20:48,380 --> 00:20:46,590 redness here basically indicates a lot 514 00:20:51,169 --> 00:20:48,390 of stellar mass that's the Spitzer data 515 00:20:52,970 --> 00:20:51,179 coming in and you see you know the 516 00:20:54,769 --> 00:20:52,980 gravitational arc to the sort of 517 00:20:57,830 --> 00:20:54,779 straight north of the middle of the 518 00:21:02,570 --> 00:20:57,840 cluster there's a very thin arc of light 519 00:21:05,630 --> 00:21:02,580 which which is the image of a distant 520 00:21:08,060 --> 00:21:05,640 galaxies whose light is being bent by 521 00:21:10,220 --> 00:21:08,070 the you know by the mass of this cluster 522 00:21:13,130 --> 00:21:10,230 a Scott could you use your pointer to 523 00:21:16,539 --> 00:21:13,140 kind of outline that for us please can 524 00:21:22,669 --> 00:21:16,549 you there ya know a little bit lower 525 00:21:24,200 --> 00:21:22,679 yeah there you go okay it's right center 526 00:21:25,909 --> 00:21:24,210 of the image now where he's got is his 527 00:21:28,039 --> 00:21:25,919 cursor yeah just to the left of the 528 00:21:32,240 --> 00:21:28,049 cursor that's right so that is that 529 00:21:33,919 --> 00:21:32,250 smudge is a galaxy that's a distant 530 00:21:36,560 --> 00:21:33,929 galaxies whose light is being distorted 531 00:21:39,830 --> 00:21:36,570 as it passes through the bent space-time 532 00:21:43,070 --> 00:21:39,840 but of the cluster and in fact that that 533 00:21:46,100 --> 00:21:43,080 arc provided us with another independent 534 00:21:48,830 --> 00:21:46,110 estimate of the mass which which was the 535 00:21:51,760 --> 00:21:48,840 subject of a paper that Anthony put out 536 00:21:56,029 --> 00:21:51,770 in 2012 you can speak to that Anthony 537 00:21:57,980 --> 00:21:56,039 sure so if you have us when you see 538 00:22:00,820 --> 00:21:57,990 something that's elongated like that's 539 00:22:03,110 --> 00:22:00,830 called a strong gravitational arc and 540 00:22:04,669 --> 00:22:03,120 just like a magnifying glass will 541 00:22:06,440 --> 00:22:04,679 distort light coming through it the mass 542 00:22:08,210 --> 00:22:06,450 of that cluster is bending the light 543 00:22:11,270 --> 00:22:08,220 from the background galaxies as it comes 544 00:22:13,250 --> 00:22:11,280 towards us and you can use the distance 545 00:22:15,139 --> 00:22:13,260 but the shape of that arc you can figure 546 00:22:15,450 --> 00:22:15,149 out where the center of it is and you 547 00:22:17,460 --> 00:22:15,460 can 548 00:22:20,789 --> 00:22:17,470 use that distortion and how large an 549 00:22:22,649 --> 00:22:20,799 area is enclosed by that circle to get 550 00:22:23,970 --> 00:22:22,659 an estimate for how much matter is 551 00:22:26,880 --> 00:22:23,980 enclosed and that includes the dark 552 00:22:30,330 --> 00:22:26,890 matter and the x-ray gas and the 553 00:22:31,830 --> 00:22:30,340 galaxies and then you can based on what 554 00:22:33,960 --> 00:22:31,840 you think the shape of a galaxy cluster 555 00:22:36,450 --> 00:22:33,970 should look like get an estimate for 556 00:22:38,610 --> 00:22:36,460 what the total mass is as well and when 557 00:22:40,019 --> 00:22:38,620 you do that you get a value that's very 558 00:22:42,330 --> 00:22:40,029 consistent with what we're now seeing 559 00:22:44,789 --> 00:22:42,340 with the x-ray okay I guess we chose me 560 00:22:46,919 --> 00:22:44,799 oh go ahead I'm just goes like this 561 00:22:48,930 --> 00:22:46,929 reminds me of what you would see in the 562 00:22:50,430 --> 00:22:48,940 frontier field survey where they're 563 00:22:51,779 --> 00:22:50,440 looking at all these galaxy clusters 564 00:22:54,360 --> 00:22:51,789 that are seeing smudges all over the 565 00:22:56,159 --> 00:22:54,370 place and they use they have models what 566 00:22:59,610 --> 00:22:56,169 they're calling lensing models for all 567 00:23:03,120 --> 00:22:59,620 of galaxy clusters you do that with this 568 00:23:04,680 --> 00:23:03,130 or is this one smudge not enough it 569 00:23:06,630 --> 00:23:04,690 seems to me like this one cleansed 570 00:23:09,180 --> 00:23:06,640 Galaxy isn't enough to make a model of 571 00:23:10,680 --> 00:23:09,190 the whole thing and right you to carol's 572 00:23:12,180 --> 00:23:10,690 point about dark matter what does this 573 00:23:14,789 --> 00:23:12,190 tell you about the distribution of dark 574 00:23:17,970 --> 00:23:14,799 matter in this cluster writes a very 575 00:23:19,769 --> 00:23:17,980 good question so first the frontier 576 00:23:21,899 --> 00:23:19,779 fields data is phenomenal with all the 577 00:23:23,820 --> 00:23:21,909 multiple different images of different 578 00:23:25,200 --> 00:23:23,830 galaxies there we are not at a stage 579 00:23:27,269 --> 00:23:25,210 where we can do anything like that right 580 00:23:30,090 --> 00:23:27,279 now we can just do a very crude estimate 581 00:23:32,490 --> 00:23:30,100 based on where that arc is of how much 582 00:23:34,560 --> 00:23:32,500 matter should be enclosed with inside of 583 00:23:35,580 --> 00:23:34,570 it so we're not close to trying to do 584 00:23:38,159 --> 00:23:35,590 something like they're doing with the 585 00:23:42,149 --> 00:23:38,169 frontier fields but you can get a first 586 00:23:44,789 --> 00:23:42,159 order estimate and what it also what 587 00:23:45,810 --> 00:23:44,799 else is interesting about it is a number 588 00:23:47,880 --> 00:23:45,820 of different people have made 589 00:23:49,620 --> 00:23:47,890 predictions for how many such 590 00:23:51,389 --> 00:23:49,630 gravitational arcs your you should be 591 00:23:53,600 --> 00:23:51,399 finding behind galaxy clusters at 592 00:23:56,279 --> 00:23:53,610 different distances away from us and 593 00:23:58,320 --> 00:23:56,289 generally for something this far away 594 00:24:01,110 --> 00:23:58,330 you would not have expected to find any 595 00:24:03,090 --> 00:24:01,120 arcs at all and if you looked already 596 00:24:06,240 --> 00:24:03,100 inspires that's really interesting so 597 00:24:08,490 --> 00:24:06,250 you're saying that the further away a 598 00:24:10,409 --> 00:24:08,500 galaxy cluster is the fewer are it 599 00:24:12,810 --> 00:24:10,419 there's a relation between distance and 600 00:24:14,490 --> 00:24:12,820 how many are you should see yeah so at 601 00:24:16,260 --> 00:24:14,500 some point the expectation is that you 602 00:24:18,990 --> 00:24:16,270 just start running out of background 603 00:24:20,820 --> 00:24:19,000 galaxies that are at proverbs sure that 604 00:24:22,529 --> 00:24:20,830 makes perfect sense yeah that does make 605 00:24:24,240 --> 00:24:22,539 sense so there's not that many earlier 606 00:24:28,139 --> 00:24:24,250 galaxies that can be detected by these 607 00:24:29,310 --> 00:24:28,149 telescopes right and so predictions if 608 00:24:31,379 --> 00:24:29,320 you look at before we found 609 00:24:35,009 --> 00:24:31,389 sorry that you really were not expecting 610 00:24:36,899 --> 00:24:35,019 to find one and that's means not 611 00:24:39,810 --> 00:24:36,909 expecting to find one behind any galaxy 612 00:24:41,399 --> 00:24:39,820 cluster over the entire sky so that 613 00:24:43,049 --> 00:24:41,409 starts telling you that there's 614 00:24:46,289 --> 00:24:43,059 something wrong with those expectations 615 00:24:48,539 --> 00:24:46,299 and still working on trying to get a 616 00:24:50,909 --> 00:24:48,549 handle on what exactly that is but one 617 00:24:52,470 --> 00:24:50,919 plausible candidate is if the dark 618 00:24:55,169 --> 00:24:52,480 matter in this cluster is more 619 00:24:56,909 --> 00:24:55,179 concentrated towards the center then you 620 00:24:59,430 --> 00:24:56,919 expect for the standard profile the 621 00:25:01,769 --> 00:24:59,440 galaxy cluster that can help you in 622 00:25:03,899 --> 00:25:01,779 terms of increasing the probability that 623 00:25:08,009 --> 00:25:03,909 some galaxy behind it will get magnified 624 00:25:10,440 --> 00:25:08,019 in this way so okay that's the first 625 00:25:13,169 --> 00:25:10,450 here so I had a question you talked 626 00:25:15,899 --> 00:25:13,179 about early on you all were talking 627 00:25:18,749 --> 00:25:15,909 about there's the radio data you had a 628 00:25:21,450 --> 00:25:18,759 radio JT had a hole that suggested that 629 00:25:24,060 --> 00:25:21,460 the microwave background was disturbed 630 00:25:27,450 --> 00:25:24,070 and there was a mass there and then you 631 00:25:30,990 --> 00:25:27,460 have the x-ray data and then you have 632 00:25:35,100 --> 00:25:31,000 the lensing phenomenon now receiving the 633 00:25:36,840 --> 00:25:35,110 optical do all those masses agree yeah 634 00:25:39,149 --> 00:25:36,850 in fact they do that was that was the 635 00:25:41,909 --> 00:25:39,159 main result of the paper that came out 636 00:25:44,220 --> 00:25:41,919 this year right it is pretty awesome 637 00:25:45,899 --> 00:25:44,230 because there are assumptions to go into 638 00:25:47,850 --> 00:25:45,909 all of those who are and they're 639 00:25:49,230 --> 00:25:47,860 different there's fewer assumptions in 640 00:25:51,210 --> 00:25:49,240 the lensing but there's still some 641 00:25:53,940 --> 00:25:51,220 there's definitely assumptions on the 642 00:25:56,039 --> 00:25:53,950 state and maturity of the gas and the 643 00:25:58,169 --> 00:25:56,049 how relax the dynamics is the cluster 644 00:26:00,720 --> 00:25:58,179 that comes into play for both the x-ray 645 00:26:02,369 --> 00:26:00,730 and for the radio data and they're all 646 00:26:03,960 --> 00:26:02,379 different that's right they all you know 647 00:26:06,060 --> 00:26:03,970 there there are different physics and 648 00:26:07,830 --> 00:26:06,070 different assumptions and and they yet 649 00:26:09,960 --> 00:26:07,840 the mass is all agree perfectly 650 00:26:12,539 --> 00:26:09,970 basically within the errors and that's 651 00:26:14,369 --> 00:26:12,549 astonishing and this is why one of the 652 00:26:16,379 --> 00:26:14,379 main conclusions is that this cluster 653 00:26:18,659 --> 00:26:16,389 seems to be relatively advanced and 654 00:26:21,749 --> 00:26:18,669 mature for its age you know it's not 655 00:26:23,960 --> 00:26:21,759 shocking to find a galaxy cluster at 656 00:26:26,759 --> 00:26:23,970 redshifts like this handfuls are known 657 00:26:28,619 --> 00:26:26,769 but mostly they look like train wrecks 658 00:26:30,060 --> 00:26:28,629 they're still forming you know they look 659 00:26:31,740 --> 00:26:30,070 like you expect them to look at that age 660 00:26:33,659 --> 00:26:31,750 where they will only look mature at a 661 00:26:35,789 --> 00:26:33,669 much later time but this one looks 662 00:26:37,919 --> 00:26:35,799 mature in place 10 billion light years 663 00:26:40,320 --> 00:26:37,929 away and you know and a lot of the 664 00:26:41,639 --> 00:26:40,330 evidence for that is that the masses are 665 00:26:42,899 --> 00:26:41,649 all the same from these different 666 00:26:44,399 --> 00:26:42,909 measurements 667 00:26:46,320 --> 00:26:44,409 you know that there's that there's the 668 00:26:48,960 --> 00:26:46,330 existence of a cool core in the cluster 669 00:26:51,060 --> 00:26:48,970 which might can speak more to but that's 670 00:26:52,830 --> 00:26:51,070 a property of an evolved cluster we 671 00:26:54,180 --> 00:26:52,840 don't usually see that in the early 672 00:26:55,979 --> 00:26:54,190 universe we see it today much more 673 00:26:57,989 --> 00:26:55,989 frequently so there's a lot of evidence 674 00:26:59,430 --> 00:26:57,999 pointing to the fact that this is an 675 00:27:01,469 --> 00:26:59,440 involved cluster at such an early time 676 00:27:04,379 --> 00:27:01,479 and the significance of that is that 677 00:27:07,289 --> 00:27:04,389 basically it's a signpost for one of the 678 00:27:08,909 --> 00:27:07,299 earliest very dense you know parts of 679 00:27:11,580 --> 00:27:08,919 the early universe it had to get a head 680 00:27:13,889 --> 00:27:11,590 start early to be finished so early and 681 00:27:16,649 --> 00:27:13,899 so this was really a very dense region 682 00:27:19,080 --> 00:27:16,659 in the very early universe so you've all 683 00:27:21,269 --> 00:27:19,090 seen that sort of cosmic web view of the 684 00:27:22,619 --> 00:27:21,279 universe with all these galaxies dancing 685 00:27:23,729 --> 00:27:22,629 around each other and these long thin 686 00:27:26,849 --> 00:27:23,739 thread so you're saying that it's 687 00:27:29,070 --> 00:27:26,859 possible this galaxy cluster was 688 00:27:31,229 --> 00:27:29,080 probably in a more dense region early in 689 00:27:33,060 --> 00:27:31,239 the universe's history that allowed it 690 00:27:35,190 --> 00:27:33,070 to get this mature correct exactly 691 00:27:37,560 --> 00:27:35,200 exactly it's a very extreme peak in the 692 00:27:40,139 --> 00:27:37,570 early density distribution and you know 693 00:27:42,089 --> 00:27:40,149 in 2012 we asked her cells if it was if 694 00:27:44,460 --> 00:27:42,099 it in fact it was allowed by modern 695 00:27:45,960 --> 00:27:44,470 cosmic by our theory should there be 696 00:27:48,330 --> 00:27:45,970 something this massive so early because 697 00:27:50,310 --> 00:27:48,340 it wasn't obvious we did the calculation 698 00:27:52,649 --> 00:27:50,320 and in fact it's okay there are a few 699 00:27:54,930 --> 00:27:52,659 all scythes that we reverse it you told 700 00:27:56,789 --> 00:27:54,940 right yeah it's actually okay there's a 701 00:27:59,700 --> 00:27:56,799 handful you know a dozen or so all sky 702 00:28:01,919 --> 00:27:59,710 we found one in a tiny tiny fraction of 703 00:28:03,930 --> 00:28:01,929 the sky which is what was strange and 704 00:28:05,609 --> 00:28:03,940 why we were so lucky we all we had way 705 00:28:08,279 --> 00:28:05,619 less than one percent chance of finding 706 00:28:10,349 --> 00:28:08,289 it in that area but we did okay all 707 00:28:12,479 --> 00:28:10,359 right so yeah let's go back to this cool 708 00:28:14,460 --> 00:28:12,489 core that you were just mentioning marca 709 00:28:17,339 --> 00:28:14,470 Mike do you want to comment a little but 710 00:28:20,879 --> 00:28:17,349 what do they mean by that is a cool cool 711 00:28:23,700 --> 00:28:20,889 for sure um let me just quickly sort of 712 00:28:26,099 --> 00:28:23,710 throw in the analogy I like to sort of 713 00:28:28,139 --> 00:28:26,109 put this resulting contents of analogies 714 00:28:30,210 --> 00:28:28,149 yeah so sorry I mean you can think of a 715 00:28:32,849 --> 00:28:30,220 galaxy cluster as like a city right of 716 00:28:36,930 --> 00:28:32,859 the galaxies of the people right and so 717 00:28:38,820 --> 00:28:36,940 as time goes by in human history cities 718 00:28:40,919 --> 00:28:38,830 become bigger you know that it go from 719 00:28:43,710 --> 00:28:40,929 villages 2 tallis the cities to drop 720 00:28:46,409 --> 00:28:43,720 traffic snorts I mean yeah right yeah so 721 00:28:48,539 --> 00:28:46,419 this is that I mean in my mind kind of 722 00:28:52,820 --> 00:28:48,549 like finding Rome you know we're finding 723 00:28:55,200 --> 00:28:52,830 one of these really advanced older 724 00:28:56,460 --> 00:28:55,210 civilizations oh no that is a good 725 00:28:58,590 --> 00:28:56,470 analogy so 726 00:29:00,419 --> 00:28:58,600 so so we found a civilization of 727 00:29:03,510 --> 00:29:00,429 galaxies that's that's probably 728 00:29:05,460 --> 00:29:03,520 benchmarking the era that it it's it's 729 00:29:11,039 --> 00:29:05,470 observed that it's the most advanced 730 00:29:14,130 --> 00:29:11,049 civilization at that innocence okay so 731 00:29:16,289 --> 00:29:14,140 that boy my simple well that begs the 732 00:29:19,620 --> 00:29:16,299 question so I guess my next thing is 733 00:29:23,399 --> 00:29:19,630 that you know you found Rome any chance 734 00:29:25,110 --> 00:29:23,409 any chance of finding a ancient Egyptian 735 00:29:26,549 --> 00:29:25,120 stuff i mean you know they were pretty 736 00:29:29,159 --> 00:29:26,559 advanced to so what do you think the 737 00:29:30,870 --> 00:29:29,169 chances are of maybe finding something 738 00:29:32,610 --> 00:29:30,880 any earlier do you think this is a 739 00:29:34,080 --> 00:29:32,620 horror limit not let anyone have you 740 00:29:35,779 --> 00:29:34,090 comment on that well i think i think 741 00:29:39,000 --> 00:29:35,789 what Mark was saying is that this is 742 00:29:40,680 --> 00:29:39,010 this is about that massive as you expect 743 00:29:42,930 --> 00:29:40,690 the universe to produce a cluster at 744 00:29:45,390 --> 00:29:42,940 this right shift at this distance so as 745 00:29:48,600 --> 00:29:45,400 I said about 10 billion light years this 746 00:29:49,890 --> 00:29:48,610 is about as good or as mature a galaxy 747 00:29:51,840 --> 00:29:49,900 clusters you're ever going to see you 748 00:29:54,539 --> 00:29:51,850 won't anything earlier is going to be 749 00:29:56,880 --> 00:29:54,549 like he said more disheveled less less 750 00:30:01,169 --> 00:29:56,890 organized the more of a mess but these 751 00:30:04,200 --> 00:30:01,179 are in like me a lot yeah it out loud 752 00:30:07,649 --> 00:30:04,210 but yeah you are thinking it in 2016 753 00:30:10,830 --> 00:30:07,659 they seek the truth yes well I glad 754 00:30:14,820 --> 00:30:10,840 that's a good resolution I'll help you a 755 00:30:16,080 --> 00:30:14,830 help you keep usually mind why don't 756 00:30:18,450 --> 00:30:16,090 your those we can name it after you 757 00:30:20,669 --> 00:30:18,460 perfect it's i'm done with let the IE 758 00:30:22,200 --> 00:30:20,679 you know we'll get it set well it's 759 00:30:25,279 --> 00:30:22,210 better than the name that the that 760 00:30:28,590 --> 00:30:25,289 you've given this thing we never see SJ 761 00:30:30,899 --> 00:30:28,600 1426 I mean Scott Lewis cluster I'd be 762 00:30:34,110 --> 00:30:30,909 much willing to come I sorry that's not 763 00:30:37,610 --> 00:30:34,120 their fault I'm okay with that too they 764 00:30:40,200 --> 00:30:37,620 do not mislead of Scott Lewis cluster 765 00:30:45,270 --> 00:30:40,210 supermassive and not as the shell that 766 00:30:51,360 --> 00:30:45,280 was as it was a few just just messed all 767 00:30:53,430 --> 00:30:51,370 up with Dark Matters ok so astral girl 1 768 00:30:54,419 --> 00:30:53,440 USA is asking a good question out that 769 00:30:56,909 --> 00:30:54,429 kind of goes along with the 770 00:30:59,520 --> 00:30:56,919 gravitational lensing i can't select it 771 00:31:01,080 --> 00:30:59,530 so if maybe Elena or someone who has the 772 00:31:03,990 --> 00:31:01,090 ability to do that can maybe click on 773 00:31:05,430 --> 00:31:04,000 her comment she's asking you may have 774 00:31:06,539 --> 00:31:05,440 covered this already i missed quite a 775 00:31:08,669 --> 00:31:06,549 bit fooling around trying to get the 776 00:31:09,340 --> 00:31:08,679 video to work but is there a difference 777 00:31:11,610 --> 00:31:09,350 in what 778 00:31:13,630 --> 00:31:11,620 causes an Einstein cross and 779 00:31:15,789 --> 00:31:13,640 gravitational arcing like what we just 780 00:31:18,370 --> 00:31:15,799 saw in that one galaxy that you should 781 00:31:19,659 --> 00:31:18,380 have in this image and she also adds I 782 00:31:23,590 --> 00:31:19,669 have to say this is a very interesting 783 00:31:25,150 --> 00:31:23,600 session well thank you astral one USA so 784 00:31:27,580 --> 00:31:25,160 let's talk about that and maybe this is 785 00:31:30,610 --> 00:31:27,590 a good one for you Anthony gravitational 786 00:31:33,909 --> 00:31:30,620 lensing arcing Einstein crosses we've 787 00:31:36,520 --> 00:31:33,919 seen a supernova recently in an Einstein 788 00:31:38,950 --> 00:31:36,530 cross so what is there this is the same 789 00:31:41,020 --> 00:31:38,960 physics at work here yes indeed in both 790 00:31:43,480 --> 00:31:41,030 cases it is just the bending of light by 791 00:31:45,340 --> 00:31:43,490 gravity as predicted by Einstein the 792 00:31:48,220 --> 00:31:45,350 main difference is just the geometry of 793 00:31:50,500 --> 00:31:48,230 exactly how the background galaxy or the 794 00:31:52,539 --> 00:31:50,510 background quasar is lined up with the 795 00:31:55,840 --> 00:31:52,549 foreground matter that's doing the 796 00:31:57,960 --> 00:31:55,850 lensing so at a fundamental physical 797 00:32:00,460 --> 00:31:57,970 level though it's it's identical physics 798 00:32:02,890 --> 00:32:00,470 okay good that's good question asker 799 00:32:04,539 --> 00:32:02,900 girl1 thank you Andrew Hamilton Einstein 800 00:32:06,669 --> 00:32:04,549 cross by the way yes we talked about 801 00:32:09,820 --> 00:32:06,679 that's the supernova ref stall i believe 802 00:32:12,430 --> 00:32:09,830 it was or something yes okay Andrew 803 00:32:14,289 --> 00:32:12,440 planet is asking would massive galaxies 804 00:32:18,070 --> 00:32:14,299 have been more prone to form right after 805 00:32:19,600 --> 00:32:18,080 the Big Bang having them there having 806 00:32:22,230 --> 00:32:19,610 been far more of a preponderant 807 00:32:24,730 --> 00:32:22,240 preponderance of material available to 808 00:32:27,580 --> 00:32:24,740 gravitationally mutually attract to 809 00:32:28,930 --> 00:32:27,590 itself the last part confused me but I'm 810 00:32:31,180 --> 00:32:28,940 gonna go back to the beginning would the 811 00:32:33,399 --> 00:32:31,190 massive galaxies have been more prone to 812 00:32:35,680 --> 00:32:33,409 form right after the Big Bang well I'll 813 00:32:37,419 --> 00:32:35,690 take that generically it's true the 814 00:32:39,100 --> 00:32:37,429 universe was denser because it was all 815 00:32:40,659 --> 00:32:39,110 the materials closer together and that 816 00:32:42,399 --> 00:32:40,669 is a plus if you're trying to form 817 00:32:45,190 --> 00:32:42,409 galaxies but it was also a lot hotter 818 00:32:47,020 --> 00:32:45,200 and you can't make gas collapse if it's 819 00:32:48,970 --> 00:32:47,030 hot so the universe has to expand and 820 00:32:51,490 --> 00:32:48,980 cool to a point where you can actually 821 00:32:53,289 --> 00:32:51,500 have gravitational collapse so it has to 822 00:32:55,180 --> 00:32:53,299 happen a bit after the Big Bang so on 823 00:32:56,620 --> 00:32:55,190 the one hand the universe is smaller but 824 00:32:59,049 --> 00:32:56,630 on the other hand it's also very hot and 825 00:33:01,600 --> 00:32:59,059 it's hard to get things to to sort of 826 00:33:04,270 --> 00:33:01,610 coalesce right right collapsing down 827 00:33:06,070 --> 00:33:04,280 means you have to have cold gas if it's 828 00:33:07,360 --> 00:33:06,080 hot temperature is basically the same 829 00:33:09,070 --> 00:33:07,370 thing as the velocity of the gas 830 00:33:10,330 --> 00:33:09,080 particles and if it's hot they're moving 831 00:33:13,149 --> 00:33:10,340 very fast and they can't come close 832 00:33:14,590 --> 00:33:13,159 together but the corollary to that if I 833 00:33:16,810 --> 00:33:14,600 understood the second part of the 834 00:33:19,299 --> 00:33:16,820 question is you're more likely to form 835 00:33:20,710 --> 00:33:19,309 very massive galaxies earlier where you 836 00:33:22,899 --> 00:33:20,720 have the densest locations in the 837 00:33:23,200 --> 00:33:22,909 universe which would be sites like where 838 00:33:25,180 --> 00:33:23,210 you're 839 00:33:26,799 --> 00:33:25,190 he's mask right so that's dense thats 840 00:33:28,539 --> 00:33:26,809 dark matter density which doesn't get 841 00:33:30,789 --> 00:33:28,549 care about the temperature as much as 842 00:33:33,100 --> 00:33:30,799 the gas dose good alright thank you 843 00:33:34,899 --> 00:33:33,110 andrea was a good question um alright so 844 00:33:38,139 --> 00:33:34,909 we want to I want to ask you briefly 845 00:33:39,669 --> 00:33:38,149 about with the radio detection you said 846 00:33:43,330 --> 00:33:39,679 that you all of these different methods 847 00:33:45,190 --> 00:33:43,340 have sort of gone in in hand in hand 848 00:33:47,470 --> 00:33:45,200 between the gravitational lensing of the 849 00:33:51,279 --> 00:33:47,480 galaxy that the art gravitational arc 850 00:33:52,750 --> 00:33:51,289 the temperature of the x-ray gas and you 851 00:33:54,460 --> 00:33:52,760 said you initially got an initial 852 00:33:57,760 --> 00:33:54,470 estimate of the mass for using radio 853 00:34:01,060 --> 00:33:57,770 data is it something Alma can do I mean 854 00:34:02,740 --> 00:34:01,070 I'm just wonder it that's that is that a 855 00:34:05,620 --> 00:34:02,750 wavelength that can give you any more 856 00:34:07,779 --> 00:34:05,630 information or is it well necessary it's 857 00:34:09,550 --> 00:34:07,789 always necessary we would be where we're 858 00:34:10,869 --> 00:34:09,560 lacking in radio facilities right now 859 00:34:13,270 --> 00:34:10,879 that can make this kind of measurement 860 00:34:14,470 --> 00:34:13,280 actually all night at you all know 861 00:34:17,440 --> 00:34:14,480 watches that went out what all you 862 00:34:19,210 --> 00:34:17,450 mentioned would only do just so all well 863 00:34:21,220 --> 00:34:19,220 ok let me just say Alma is a radio 864 00:34:22,810 --> 00:34:21,230 interferon interfer metric array it's a 865 00:34:24,879 --> 00:34:22,820 bunch of dishes in the mountains of 866 00:34:27,550 --> 00:34:24,889 chili and when you use them all together 867 00:34:31,720 --> 00:34:27,560 you can gather you can sort of 868 00:34:33,700 --> 00:34:31,730 approximate the the resolution of a huge 869 00:34:35,109 --> 00:34:33,710 dish as big as the the largest linear 870 00:34:37,000 --> 00:34:35,119 extent between you know the largest 871 00:34:39,639 --> 00:34:37,010 separation between any of those two 872 00:34:41,770 --> 00:34:39,649 small dishes that's great for resolution 873 00:34:42,820 --> 00:34:41,780 the that's actually a bad thing though 874 00:34:45,490 --> 00:34:42,830 if you're trying to make this 875 00:34:47,800 --> 00:34:45,500 measurement use a solution is a bad 876 00:34:51,490 --> 00:34:47,810 thing yeah because you end up we're 877 00:34:53,680 --> 00:34:51,500 looking at if you if you think about the 878 00:34:56,260 --> 00:34:53,690 x-ray image and maybe we can call that 879 00:34:58,690 --> 00:34:56,270 up again the blue fuzzy image the the 880 00:35:00,790 --> 00:34:58,700 galaxy cluster is not a point it's it's 881 00:35:03,310 --> 00:35:00,800 actually a very big area it's a big 882 00:35:05,470 --> 00:35:03,320 extended area of light and if you're 883 00:35:07,900 --> 00:35:05,480 using an interferometric array a bunch 884 00:35:09,220 --> 00:35:07,910 of small dishes you actually are it's 885 00:35:11,770 --> 00:35:09,230 very good at detecting the point sources 886 00:35:13,450 --> 00:35:11,780 but it resolves it resolves out the 887 00:35:16,060 --> 00:35:13,460 light you you want to sort of not lose 888 00:35:17,530 --> 00:35:16,070 that light if you had a very big single 889 00:35:19,750 --> 00:35:17,540 dish in the radio that wouldn't happen 890 00:35:22,450 --> 00:35:19,760 and that would be fabulous for that kind 891 00:35:24,849 --> 00:35:22,460 of analysis but Alma is not great 892 00:35:28,120 --> 00:35:24,859 actually for measuring things like the 893 00:35:29,890 --> 00:35:28,130 the the effect of the CMB spectral 894 00:35:31,750 --> 00:35:29,900 distortion because it's a very large 895 00:35:33,609 --> 00:35:31,760 scale distortion and being so high 896 00:35:35,770 --> 00:35:33,619 resolution you actually can't see it 897 00:35:36,940 --> 00:35:35,780 basically the idea is you do a you 898 00:35:39,220 --> 00:35:36,950 subtract effect 899 00:35:40,480 --> 00:35:39,230 you subtract what's around it's locally 900 00:35:41,680 --> 00:35:40,490 around the object that you're looking at 901 00:35:43,030 --> 00:35:41,690 and if it's all the same brightness 902 00:35:44,560 --> 00:35:43,040 where you're looking in the background 903 00:35:47,890 --> 00:35:44,570 around it then it subtracts away 904 00:35:49,660 --> 00:35:47,900 entirely you get zero so so that's why 905 00:35:51,970 --> 00:35:49,670 Alma's not the perfect instrument for 906 00:35:55,750 --> 00:35:51,980 that kind of okay all right Oh Scott 907 00:35:59,020 --> 00:35:55,760 head up so here's the IR that Spitzer 908 00:36:01,960 --> 00:35:59,030 right right okay and then you said you 909 00:36:04,599 --> 00:36:01,970 want to Chandra yeah yeah this is the IR 910 00:36:06,069 --> 00:36:04,609 on now and you see a few of the galaxies 911 00:36:07,660 --> 00:36:06,079 so they're shaundra and if you ignore 912 00:36:10,000 --> 00:36:07,670 the point so you look at the big blue 913 00:36:12,609 --> 00:36:10,010 fuzzy region in the middle that's the 914 00:36:14,920 --> 00:36:12,619 sort of the extent of the hot gas in the 915 00:36:18,730 --> 00:36:14,930 cluster it's a very big extended region 916 00:36:21,490 --> 00:36:18,740 sort of 30 arc seconds on the side okay 917 00:36:23,260 --> 00:36:21,500 so well while we're on trays then let me 918 00:36:25,599 --> 00:36:23,270 ask you this and resolution doesn't 919 00:36:28,240 --> 00:36:25,609 matter or at least it's not as is as 920 00:36:31,150 --> 00:36:28,250 critical as it might be an optical image 921 00:36:33,099 --> 00:36:31,160 but what about new star is that 922 00:36:34,569 --> 00:36:33,109 something that can give you I mean it's 923 00:36:37,390 --> 00:36:34,579 a slightly different energy level I know 924 00:36:39,609 --> 00:36:37,400 that but it have you thought about maybe 925 00:36:42,280 --> 00:36:39,619 what do you think new Tsar might show if 926 00:36:44,109 --> 00:36:42,290 well I'll toss this one to Mike but 927 00:36:45,640 --> 00:36:44,119 generically it's just too high energy 928 00:36:48,940 --> 00:36:45,650 but Mike probably can get some color on 929 00:36:51,130 --> 00:36:48,950 that right I'll also add a little the 930 00:36:54,160 --> 00:36:51,140 easy answer for the Alma question is 931 00:36:58,710 --> 00:36:54,170 that this targets in the north well 932 00:37:01,059 --> 00:36:58,720 there we actually you're gonna say that 933 00:37:03,250 --> 00:37:01,069 this was in the north right yeah we 934 00:37:04,720 --> 00:37:03,260 actually can we actually can it's doable 935 00:37:08,650 --> 00:37:04,730 but you can see it right on the horizon 936 00:37:11,380 --> 00:37:08,660 yeah you guys ground-based telescopes 937 00:37:13,359 --> 00:37:11,390 yes so with with regard did you say 938 00:37:15,490 --> 00:37:13,369 Fermi which tells before you know I was 939 00:37:18,700 --> 00:37:15,500 I was wondering about new store start 940 00:37:20,880 --> 00:37:18,710 right yeah so we so if there was another 941 00:37:25,059 --> 00:37:20,890 process going on that wasn't thermal 942 00:37:26,349 --> 00:37:25,069 you'd expect new star to pick it up we 943 00:37:29,319 --> 00:37:26,359 have no reason to believe that's the 944 00:37:33,069 --> 00:37:29,329 case here so so all of our thermal 945 00:37:34,480 --> 00:37:33,079 emission is captured by a Chandra ok 946 00:37:36,460 --> 00:37:34,490 that's a good end so you're saying that 947 00:37:39,160 --> 00:37:36,470 what Chandra is looking at is thermal 948 00:37:40,990 --> 00:37:39,170 emission in x-rays right what else is 949 00:37:42,550 --> 00:37:41,000 there i mean it's some kind of what 950 00:37:45,760 --> 00:37:42,560 other kind of x-ray emission would there 951 00:37:47,589 --> 00:37:45,770 be then so accretion disks shop 952 00:37:49,430 --> 00:37:47,599 accelerating shop celebrating 953 00:37:51,589 --> 00:37:49,440 accelerating charged particles maybe 954 00:37:54,500 --> 00:37:51,599 Thank kind of thing yeah so very very 955 00:37:57,079 --> 00:37:54,510 energetic Austin sees but I mean we 956 00:38:00,109 --> 00:37:57,089 struggle to measure that those types of 957 00:38:04,030 --> 00:38:00,119 things in nearby clusters so this is not 958 00:38:06,230 --> 00:38:04,040 a test fit for brand new star I think 959 00:38:08,450 --> 00:38:06,240 okay well no that's good to know I mean 960 00:38:10,940 --> 00:38:08,460 I I just learned about new star died 961 00:38:12,410 --> 00:38:10,950 about a year ago and it was pretty 962 00:38:14,510 --> 00:38:12,420 amazing some of the stuff I've seen come 963 00:38:16,099 --> 00:38:14,520 out of there they would I think they 964 00:38:17,540 --> 00:38:16,109 just looked at the Andromeda galaxy with 965 00:38:18,980 --> 00:38:17,550 it recently if i'm not mistaken so 966 00:38:23,089 --> 00:38:18,990 here's a good question from Craig 967 00:38:25,430 --> 00:38:23,099 kranthi ugh oh gosh good good hot am I'm 968 00:38:29,420 --> 00:38:25,440 sorry if I screwed that up but he's 969 00:38:32,329 --> 00:38:29,430 asking is big is does this galaxy 970 00:38:35,660 --> 00:38:32,339 cluster have any net rotation or is 971 00:38:41,089 --> 00:38:35,670 there any overall motion of the galaxy 972 00:38:43,069 --> 00:38:41,099 cluster itself ah almost certainly any 973 00:38:47,599 --> 00:38:43,079 other are you yeah are you able to 974 00:38:49,460 --> 00:38:47,609 measure it we only have detailed sort of 975 00:38:52,550 --> 00:38:49,470 dynamical information for a handful of 976 00:38:55,670 --> 00:38:52,560 the galaxies as I said using Hubble and 977 00:38:58,970 --> 00:38:55,680 keck spectroscopy most of that isn't 978 00:39:00,800 --> 00:38:58,980 even at sufficient precision to do much 979 00:39:03,140 --> 00:39:00,810 with other than know the distance from 980 00:39:06,559 --> 00:39:03,150 us to the galaxy so yeah it would take a 981 00:39:07,819 --> 00:39:06,569 pretty dedicated survey over a long 982 00:39:09,589 --> 00:39:07,829 period of time to build even start to 983 00:39:11,450 --> 00:39:09,599 answer that question yeah i think the 984 00:39:14,450 --> 00:39:11,460 echo what Mike was saying a second ago 985 00:39:16,579 --> 00:39:14,460 this is hard to do even locally right so 986 00:39:18,140 --> 00:39:16,589 it's a bit out of the realm for right 987 00:39:21,740 --> 00:39:18,150 now for this movie so you're saying 988 00:39:23,599 --> 00:39:21,750 looking at at these galaxies clusters is 989 00:39:25,640 --> 00:39:23,609 hard to do even for closer clusters but 990 00:39:27,380 --> 00:39:25,650 trying to measure the rotation of them 991 00:39:30,440 --> 00:39:27,390 even for a little monsters is not an 992 00:39:32,450 --> 00:39:30,450 easy job okay well mark I'm glad you 993 00:39:36,410 --> 00:39:32,460 reminded me about heck I wanted to ask 994 00:39:37,309 --> 00:39:36,420 you what data you used for that from 995 00:39:40,550 --> 00:39:37,319 them and you're saying it was 996 00:39:43,849 --> 00:39:40,560 spectroscopy yeah back in 2012 we did 997 00:39:45,230 --> 00:39:43,859 some pretty heroic observations given 998 00:39:48,740 --> 00:39:45,240 the redshift of the cluster and the 999 00:39:51,440 --> 00:39:48,750 screen galaxies yeah we'd we observed 1000 00:39:53,630 --> 00:39:51,450 with the Elridge spectrograph the low 1001 00:39:55,339 --> 00:39:53,640 resolution imaging spectrograph on the 1002 00:39:58,490 --> 00:39:55,349 Keck one telescope but I think that's 1003 00:40:01,490 --> 00:39:58,500 what it was and and observed for you 1004 00:40:03,410 --> 00:40:01,500 know four or five hours normally you can 1005 00:40:05,599 --> 00:40:03,420 get the distances to 1006 00:40:07,730 --> 00:40:05,609 Buster's at more normal red ships you 1007 00:40:09,500 --> 00:40:07,740 know the clusters that are around seven 1008 00:40:12,289 --> 00:40:09,510 or eight or nine billion light-years 1009 00:40:14,030 --> 00:40:12,299 away well eight anyway in an hour and a 1010 00:40:15,920 --> 00:40:14,040 half or two but this was pretty heroic 1011 00:40:17,750 --> 00:40:15,930 because of the distance and it was a 1012 00:40:20,690 --> 00:40:17,760 difficult redshift range to do from the 1013 00:40:23,210 --> 00:40:20,700 ground we only ended up actually only 1014 00:40:27,470 --> 00:40:23,220 getting as I recall one spectroscopic 1015 00:40:28,910 --> 00:40:27,480 member ha from from we targeted many all 1016 00:40:31,250 --> 00:40:28,920 at the same time in parallel but we only 1017 00:40:33,650 --> 00:40:31,260 got a redshift for one of them and it's 1018 00:40:35,120 --> 00:40:33,660 Hubble actually from space that was much 1019 00:40:37,609 --> 00:40:35,130 better able to give us the distance we 1020 00:40:40,099 --> 00:40:37,619 got six or seven pretty quickly from 1021 00:40:43,760 --> 00:40:40,109 from observations with the the grizzin 1022 00:40:45,920 --> 00:40:43,770 from the infrared camera okay well now 1023 00:40:47,839 --> 00:40:45,930 it's time for the grand question the 1024 00:40:50,510 --> 00:40:47,849 bloody scale questions that I love to 1025 00:40:52,870 --> 00:40:50,520 ask so let me these observations in this 1026 00:40:58,880 --> 00:40:52,880 study of this particular galaxy cluster 1027 00:41:01,069 --> 00:40:58,890 was it has it it has it disproven or 1028 00:41:03,829 --> 00:41:01,079 lent support to any of the current 1029 00:41:05,150 --> 00:41:03,839 theories of gravity of how galaxies form 1030 00:41:06,859 --> 00:41:05,160 in the early universe and more 1031 00:41:09,620 --> 00:41:06,869 importantly galaxy clusters in other 1032 00:41:12,200 --> 00:41:09,630 words observations we have more theories 1033 00:41:14,180 --> 00:41:12,210 than observations usually have any have 1034 00:41:15,859 --> 00:41:14,190 any come under fire as a result of what 1035 00:41:18,559 --> 00:41:15,869 you found or have you supported any 1036 00:41:21,440 --> 00:41:18,569 theories um generically everything makes 1037 00:41:23,660 --> 00:41:21,450 sense with one big exception the the 1038 00:41:25,549 --> 00:41:23,670 mass of the cluster is high but it does 1039 00:41:27,680 --> 00:41:25,559 it's not unusual it's not surprising 1040 00:41:28,880 --> 00:41:27,690 that you would find it you know it's 1041 00:41:31,280 --> 00:41:28,890 surprising that we found it in such a 1042 00:41:33,650 --> 00:41:31,290 small area so when we're able to conduct 1043 00:41:35,299 --> 00:41:33,660 a full Sky Survey to the same depth we 1044 00:41:37,099 --> 00:41:35,309 should find the remaining handful that 1045 00:41:39,079 --> 00:41:37,109 we expect there to be if we find many 1046 00:41:40,280 --> 00:41:39,089 many more than that then that would be a 1047 00:41:43,370 --> 00:41:40,290 problem but right now there's no 1048 00:41:46,039 --> 00:41:43,380 indication of a problem on that side the 1049 00:41:48,109 --> 00:41:46,049 on in terms of the the gas properties of 1050 00:41:50,870 --> 00:41:48,119 the cluster it's it's pretty advanced 1051 00:41:54,020 --> 00:41:50,880 but you know it doesn't you know it 1052 00:41:55,910 --> 00:41:54,030 doesn't make its not worrisome in any 1053 00:41:57,500 --> 00:41:55,920 way the problem there is hard to predict 1054 00:41:59,930 --> 00:41:57,510 what you expect to see because you need 1055 00:42:02,150 --> 00:41:59,940 very advanced simulations that that are 1056 00:42:04,010 --> 00:42:02,160 right now not up to the task actually of 1057 00:42:05,930 --> 00:42:04,020 making a prediction that we could go 1058 00:42:07,819 --> 00:42:05,940 test in terms of the gas inside of 1059 00:42:10,220 --> 00:42:07,829 clusters at high redshift though the one 1060 00:42:11,599 --> 00:42:10,230 case that's still rather puzzling is the 1061 00:42:15,260 --> 00:42:11,609 one Anthony brought up about the arc 1062 00:42:17,260 --> 00:42:15,270 because you know we really tried to to 1063 00:42:19,720 --> 00:42:17,270 break that you know we do we tried to 1064 00:42:21,040 --> 00:42:19,730 to test our measurement you know or 1065 00:42:23,650 --> 00:42:21,050 rather the prediction that there should 1066 00:42:26,950 --> 00:42:23,660 be none robustly none all sky we tried 1067 00:42:29,290 --> 00:42:26,960 to every which way that we can make it 1068 00:42:30,910 --> 00:42:29,300 less severe of a contradiction but no 1069 00:42:33,130 --> 00:42:30,920 matter what we did it's really just not 1070 00:42:36,070 --> 00:42:33,140 you don't expect any and and the fact 1071 00:42:40,510 --> 00:42:36,080 that we see one is still a surprise it 1072 00:42:42,840 --> 00:42:40,520 is possible that that very cigar like 1073 00:42:44,800 --> 00:42:42,850 yeah like a cigar in the sky 1074 00:42:46,690 --> 00:42:44,810 distribution of dark matter all along 1075 00:42:51,070 --> 00:42:46,700 the line of sight might help alleviate 1076 00:42:52,930 --> 00:42:51,080 that somewhat but but I mind personnel 1077 00:42:54,880 --> 00:42:52,940 still a little confused by for them but 1078 00:42:57,130 --> 00:42:54,890 if that was the case you'd have an extra 1079 00:42:58,690 --> 00:42:57,140 problem because in that case the 1080 00:43:00,070 --> 00:42:58,700 different masses that we get Fred the 1081 00:43:03,460 --> 00:43:00,080 different techniques wouldn't agree with 1082 00:43:05,430 --> 00:43:03,470 each other yeah and very likely yeah 1083 00:43:07,690 --> 00:43:05,440 well we didn't mention before actually 1084 00:43:08,890 --> 00:43:07,700 started to say I've had a student who's 1085 00:43:10,150 --> 00:43:08,900 working on what's called weak 1086 00:43:12,040 --> 00:43:10,160 gravitational lensing were you looking 1087 00:43:14,890 --> 00:43:12,050 to deflections of all the small galaxies 1088 00:43:16,270 --> 00:43:14,900 around and her name's when we mow and 1089 00:43:18,640 --> 00:43:16,280 she's just finishing up a paper that 1090 00:43:21,640 --> 00:43:18,650 shows that that mass more or less agrees 1091 00:43:23,200 --> 00:43:21,650 with the other ones as well yeah yeah so 1092 00:43:25,060 --> 00:43:23,210 the fact that this arc was there really 1093 00:43:26,170 --> 00:43:25,070 kind of was was bothersome but if it 1094 00:43:28,030 --> 00:43:26,180 weren't there then you wouldn't have 1095 00:43:30,520 --> 00:43:28,040 these agreements among the different 1096 00:43:32,470 --> 00:43:30,530 methods on this mass so well we have one 1097 00:43:35,350 --> 00:43:32,480 less mass to throw up on the plot yeah 1098 00:43:37,210 --> 00:43:35,360 but it would be it would be less 1099 00:43:39,970 --> 00:43:37,220 surprising surprising is good surprising 1100 00:43:42,280 --> 00:43:39,980 is why we do this yes I a bothersome as 1101 00:43:46,030 --> 00:43:42,290 much as intriguing in front hey 1102 00:43:47,980 --> 00:43:46,040 bothering okay so I'd like to point out 1103 00:43:50,530 --> 00:43:47,990 also that this gravitational lensing 1104 00:43:51,990 --> 00:43:50,540 technique of measuring mass or inferring 1105 00:43:54,520 --> 00:43:52,000 mass I guess is what you're really doing 1106 00:43:57,070 --> 00:43:54,530 doesn't differentiate between the mass 1107 00:43:59,620 --> 00:43:57,080 and the stuff that we can see the normal 1108 00:44:03,700 --> 00:43:59,630 matter and dark matter does it it really 1109 00:44:06,820 --> 00:44:03,710 is all of it combined correct okay so 1110 00:44:09,370 --> 00:44:06,830 the the it does it is it helping us 1111 00:44:11,830 --> 00:44:09,380 understand the nature of dark matter in 1112 00:44:14,170 --> 00:44:11,840 the early universe at all or is it just 1113 00:44:17,160 --> 00:44:14,180 you just know it's there and so it's 1114 00:44:21,100 --> 00:44:17,170 made this a fact or its had this effect 1115 00:44:23,980 --> 00:44:21,110 it's a more oh go ahead go ahead you go 1116 00:44:25,480 --> 00:44:23,990 ahead I would say it's more along the 1117 00:44:26,980 --> 00:44:25,490 lines of you know it's there you're 1118 00:44:28,300 --> 00:44:26,990 still seeing the same evidence for dark 1119 00:44:31,059 --> 00:44:28,310 matter here that you're seeing more 1120 00:44:33,309 --> 00:44:31,069 locally there's nothing there 1121 00:44:34,870 --> 00:44:33,319 is clearly no dramatic change right 1122 00:44:36,939 --> 00:44:34,880 there's no evidence for evolution and if 1123 00:44:39,219 --> 00:44:36,949 you wanted to use clusters to study dark 1124 00:44:40,630 --> 00:44:39,229 matter which is a great thing to do you 1125 00:44:42,849 --> 00:44:40,640 would want to do it more locally where 1126 00:44:44,920 --> 00:44:42,859 you have a much better ability to study 1127 00:44:46,239 --> 00:44:44,930 them in detail okay well I guess where I 1128 00:44:47,920 --> 00:44:46,249 was heading with that is that in the 1129 00:44:50,890 --> 00:44:47,930 same way that people are trying to 1130 00:44:53,410 --> 00:44:50,900 understand the characteristics of dark 1131 00:44:55,359 --> 00:44:53,420 energy over over the history of universe 1132 00:44:58,420 --> 00:44:55,369 like was it this isn't the same 1133 00:44:59,859 --> 00:44:58,430 everywhere is it you know it was it were 1134 00:45:01,930 --> 00:44:59,869 there different amounts of it at 1135 00:45:03,519 --> 00:45:01,940 different periods and the history of the 1136 00:45:05,049 --> 00:45:03,529 universe I'm trying to figure out if 1137 00:45:06,969 --> 00:45:05,059 maybe something analogous could be 1138 00:45:08,680 --> 00:45:06,979 learned by the nature of dark matter 1139 00:45:10,539 --> 00:45:08,690 like I know the universe was smaller I 1140 00:45:13,479 --> 00:45:10,549 know that this particular galaxy cluster 1141 00:45:16,209 --> 00:45:13,489 is mature and and small for its eyes are 1142 00:45:17,859 --> 00:45:16,219 small for its mass but I just wondered 1143 00:45:19,180 --> 00:45:17,869 what that might tell us if anything 1144 00:45:21,910 --> 00:45:19,190 about dark matter and it sounds like 1145 00:45:23,859 --> 00:45:21,920 only that it's there is the ulcer from 1146 00:45:27,069 --> 00:45:23,869 the from the x-ray you can get a 1147 00:45:29,739 --> 00:45:27,079 measurement of the luminous matter as 1148 00:45:32,170 --> 00:45:29,749 well and if you remove the or if you 1149 00:45:33,519 --> 00:45:32,180 compare the luminous to dark matter the 1150 00:45:35,499 --> 00:45:33,529 Dark Matters about eighty-five percent 1151 00:45:37,509 --> 00:45:35,509 of the mass in this cluster which is a 1152 00:45:40,870 --> 00:45:37,519 bit of what it is throughout the whole 1153 00:45:43,059 --> 00:45:40,880 universe so I mean in this one case you 1154 00:45:45,699 --> 00:45:43,069 know with a data point one single data 1155 00:45:48,789 --> 00:45:45,709 point we can say that the Dark Matter 1156 00:45:51,420 --> 00:45:48,799 fraction isn't really changing ok right 1157 00:45:53,709 --> 00:45:51,430 look to me that's important I think that 1158 00:45:54,699 --> 00:45:53,719 but it sort of had to be actually 1159 00:45:56,289 --> 00:45:54,709 because you know your question about 1160 00:45:59,170 --> 00:45:56,299 Direct Energy is right there's a huge 1161 00:46:01,390 --> 00:45:59,180 search on for you know to study its its 1162 00:46:03,459 --> 00:46:01,400 nature in particular is it changing is 1163 00:46:05,829 --> 00:46:03,469 it evolving with time because if it is 1164 00:46:08,680 --> 00:46:05,839 then it's not Einstein's cosmological 1165 00:46:11,229 --> 00:46:08,690 constant it's an even weirder kind of 1166 00:46:13,539 --> 00:46:11,239 quantum field and so that's an active 1167 00:46:15,549 --> 00:46:13,549 area of research Dark Matter on the 1168 00:46:16,989 --> 00:46:15,559 other hand you know we talk about all 1169 00:46:18,519 --> 00:46:16,999 our models and whether or not these 1170 00:46:19,930 --> 00:46:18,529 observations agree with the models the 1171 00:46:21,729 --> 00:46:19,940 models are all predicated on non 1172 00:46:23,589 --> 00:46:21,739 evolving dark matter dark matter has 1173 00:46:25,449 --> 00:46:23,599 whatever properties it has in the big 1174 00:46:28,390 --> 00:46:25,459 bang as that far back it has the same 1175 00:46:29,949 --> 00:46:28,400 properties today it's a little slower 1176 00:46:32,650 --> 00:46:29,959 moving today because universe is cool 1177 00:46:34,630 --> 00:46:32,660 but it's the same basic dark matter with 1178 00:46:36,219 --> 00:46:34,640 no evolution and if you brought in the 1179 00:46:37,870 --> 00:46:36,229 ability for dark matter to evolve and 1180 00:46:39,200 --> 00:46:37,880 change then the models will get much 1181 00:46:42,440 --> 00:46:39,210 more complicated 1182 00:46:43,700 --> 00:46:42,450 so dark matter is more or less what it 1183 00:46:45,290 --> 00:46:43,710 was at the beginning of the it was the 1184 00:46:47,839 --> 00:46:45,300 amount of it was set at the beginning of 1185 00:46:49,040 --> 00:46:47,849 the universe and that's what we have to 1186 00:46:51,410 --> 00:46:49,050 work with is what you're saying right 1187 00:46:53,750 --> 00:46:51,420 and its properties and its properties so 1188 00:46:55,070 --> 00:46:53,760 whatever it is we find hopefully we'll 1189 00:46:56,990 --> 00:46:55,080 find out at one point but it doesn't 1190 00:46:59,480 --> 00:46:57,000 seem to change all that much I guess I 1191 00:47:01,040 --> 00:46:59,490 was I guess it would be really freaky if 1192 00:47:03,410 --> 00:47:01,050 it wasn't conserved right i mean if you 1193 00:47:04,970 --> 00:47:03,420 suddenly went from Dark Matter more of 1194 00:47:06,859 --> 00:47:04,980 it in the early universe than later it 1195 00:47:09,380 --> 00:47:06,869 would probably be a real real problems 1196 00:47:11,390 --> 00:47:09,390 what we're going to animal you can 1197 00:47:12,650 --> 00:47:11,400 imagine doing that if it was going from 1198 00:47:15,579 --> 00:47:12,660 dark matter to turning into something 1199 00:47:18,020 --> 00:47:15,589 else other types of particles however 1200 00:47:19,970 --> 00:47:18,030 given all the other observations we have 1201 00:47:23,060 --> 00:47:19,980 from the Cosmic Microwave Background for 1202 00:47:25,550 --> 00:47:23,070 instance and that really constrains that 1203 00:47:26,599 --> 00:47:25,560 you can't have much changing okay all 1204 00:47:27,950 --> 00:47:26,609 right well I'd love to talk about that 1205 00:47:29,780 --> 00:47:27,960 at some point but I think it's a little 1206 00:47:33,349 --> 00:47:29,790 beyond what we're doing here so okay 1207 00:47:36,740 --> 00:47:33,359 well um so let me turn to Scott have you 1208 00:47:38,120 --> 00:47:36,750 noticed anything on the Twitterverse or 1209 00:47:41,240 --> 00:47:38,130 any other of the channels I'm only 1210 00:47:42,859 --> 00:47:41,250 looking at the at the q no no everything 1211 00:47:45,290 --> 00:47:42,869 on twitter has actually been pretty much 1212 00:47:48,980 --> 00:47:45,300 answered overall we were on air which is 1213 00:47:50,780 --> 00:47:48,990 always good um besides that I'm not 1214 00:47:53,540 --> 00:47:50,790 saying anything over on google+ and 1215 00:47:55,520 --> 00:47:53,550 facebook let me just check if you 1216 00:47:57,530 --> 00:47:55,530 there's a youtube comments real quick 1217 00:47:58,790 --> 00:47:57,540 you know everything's been great there's 1218 00:48:00,890 --> 00:47:58,800 been a lot of really good activity as 1219 00:48:03,500 --> 00:48:00,900 far as engagement on Twitter so thank 1220 00:48:06,950 --> 00:48:03,510 you guys for for tweeting with us as 1221 00:48:09,500 --> 00:48:06,960 we're going on I I guess I had a couple 1222 00:48:15,109 --> 00:48:09,510 questions and one is that so there's 1223 00:48:17,930 --> 00:48:15,119 this cluster and you somewhat said that 1224 00:48:20,839 --> 00:48:17,940 it's a little bit unusual but not hugely 1225 00:48:25,630 --> 00:48:20,849 unusual but is there anything in this 1226 00:48:29,599 --> 00:48:25,640 cluster that suggests a merging or 1227 00:48:32,089 --> 00:48:29,609 hierarchical galaxy formation or 1228 00:48:36,680 --> 00:48:32,099 anything like that any hints of what 1229 00:48:39,349 --> 00:48:36,690 went on before is this a tracer of any 1230 00:48:43,130 --> 00:48:39,359 of those mechanisms for creating 1231 00:48:48,430 --> 00:48:43,140 galaxies and then galaxy clusters yeah 1232 00:48:51,260 --> 00:48:48,440 I'll take that one so in the x-ray a map 1233 00:48:53,090 --> 00:48:51,270 if you have the composite image I'd be a 1234 00:48:57,110 --> 00:48:53,100 good one to show 1235 00:48:59,930 --> 00:48:57,120 the x-ray gas is sort of offset from the 1236 00:49:03,880 --> 00:48:59,940 center of the cluster and so if you 1237 00:49:06,410 --> 00:49:03,890 imagine the cluster of the clusters this 1238 00:49:08,840 --> 00:49:06,420 don't matter potential it's full of hot 1239 00:49:11,270 --> 00:49:08,850 gas and if it's disturb the gas it's 1240 00:49:13,850 --> 00:49:11,280 going to splash around in that dark 1241 00:49:16,100 --> 00:49:13,860 matter world just like glass of wine in 1242 00:49:18,740 --> 00:49:16,110 the glass and so we're seeing that the 1243 00:49:20,210 --> 00:49:18,750 gas is sort of sloshing from the center 1244 00:49:22,490 --> 00:49:20,220 of the cluster and eventually it'll sort 1245 00:49:24,830 --> 00:49:22,500 of fall back in towards the center but 1246 00:49:26,600 --> 00:49:24,840 that's sort of a signature that that 1247 00:49:29,360 --> 00:49:26,610 it's been knocked around a little bit or 1248 00:49:33,080 --> 00:49:29,370 that it's had a bit of a violent past so 1249 00:49:34,550 --> 00:49:33,090 to speak okay well I want to go back to 1250 00:49:37,370 --> 00:49:34,560 something I heard I think it was Mark 1251 00:49:41,030 --> 00:49:37,380 say about it if we could get an all-sky 1252 00:49:43,100 --> 00:49:41,040 survey of the same depth yeah is there 1253 00:49:45,860 --> 00:49:43,110 what could get work where could we go to 1254 00:49:50,420 --> 00:49:45,870 get one of those well funny you should 1255 00:49:52,190 --> 00:49:50,430 ask none of us are actually working on 1256 00:49:53,930 --> 00:49:52,200 that right now there's a there's a 1257 00:49:57,050 --> 00:49:53,940 mission called Euclid that is being 1258 00:49:58,970 --> 00:49:57,060 built in Europe and it's designed 1259 00:50:00,800 --> 00:49:58,980 actually to measure dark energy that's 1260 00:50:04,900 --> 00:50:00,810 the prime mission Euclid is of course 1261 00:50:07,820 --> 00:50:04,910 the famous geometry Greek professor and 1262 00:50:10,520 --> 00:50:07,830 and it's all about the geometry 1263 00:50:13,160 --> 00:50:10,530 basically is is the key question in dark 1264 00:50:15,890 --> 00:50:13,170 energy you know what is the nature of 1265 00:50:18,290 --> 00:50:15,900 space-time itself but a side effect of 1266 00:50:19,880 --> 00:50:18,300 that survey is that it you know will be 1267 00:50:22,370 --> 00:50:19,890 able to do an amazing cluster search 1268 00:50:24,410 --> 00:50:22,380 with it it's going to image basically 1269 00:50:25,880 --> 00:50:24,420 the whole extra galactic sky that 1270 00:50:27,020 --> 00:50:25,890 doesn't you know that does the part of 1271 00:50:28,880 --> 00:50:27,030 the guy that doesn't have our galaxy 1272 00:50:30,740 --> 00:50:28,890 blocking it so the whole rest of the sky 1273 00:50:32,840 --> 00:50:30,750 which is a milky way band that you see 1274 00:50:35,180 --> 00:50:32,850 in a really dark sky or at least yeah 1275 00:50:39,140 --> 00:50:35,190 it's gonna look not there everywhere 1276 00:50:41,690 --> 00:50:39,150 else and and it's going to take very 1277 00:50:43,400 --> 00:50:41,700 deep high-resolution images almost 1278 00:50:45,590 --> 00:50:43,410 Hubble how about half the resolution of 1279 00:50:49,130 --> 00:50:45,600 public because it's half the size and 1280 00:50:51,050 --> 00:50:49,140 have the linear size and from those data 1281 00:50:53,870 --> 00:50:51,060 we will be able to find galaxy clusters 1282 00:50:56,210 --> 00:50:53,880 to this red shift and even further if 1283 00:50:59,450 --> 00:50:56,220 they should exist in fact that's where 1284 00:51:01,400 --> 00:50:59,460 that Anthony and I are working on we're 1285 00:51:04,880 --> 00:51:01,410 part of the NASA contribution to that 1286 00:51:06,170 --> 00:51:04,890 the NASA science team and it's a like I 1287 00:51:06,890 --> 00:51:06,180 said a majority European mission but 1288 00:51:09,060 --> 00:51:06,900 we're 1289 00:51:10,860 --> 00:51:09,070 working on the cluster the galaxy 1290 00:51:13,230 --> 00:51:10,870 cluster part among other parts so that's 1291 00:51:15,930 --> 00:51:13,240 supposed to launch in 2020 or maybe 20 1292 00:51:17,400 --> 00:51:15,940 21 more realistically and the next few 1293 00:51:19,410 --> 00:51:17,410 years after that we will have amazing 1294 00:51:22,290 --> 00:51:19,420 data that should allow us to find the 1295 00:51:25,950 --> 00:51:22,300 rest of these all the friends of I dcs 1296 00:51:29,520 --> 00:51:25,960 1426 the entire sky minus the plane of 1297 00:51:31,890 --> 00:51:29,530 the galaxy about half this yeah wow 1298 00:51:33,150 --> 00:51:31,900 that's going to be a man net and so 2021 1299 00:51:35,400 --> 00:51:33,160 excellent well you're gonna have to come 1300 00:51:37,080 --> 00:51:35,410 back way before then and tell us how 1301 00:51:39,300 --> 00:51:37,090 things are going because I that sounds 1302 00:51:41,010 --> 00:51:39,310 like an amazing serve and it's going to 1303 00:51:43,950 --> 00:51:41,020 be a survey telescope right meaning that 1304 00:51:45,420 --> 00:51:43,960 it's gonna just systematically look at 1305 00:51:47,280 --> 00:51:45,430 the entire sky instead of people 1306 00:51:48,960 --> 00:51:47,290 applying for time and looking at that's 1307 00:51:50,760 --> 00:51:48,970 right yeah that's right it's a pure it's 1308 00:51:52,290 --> 00:51:50,770 a pure mission it's going to carry out 1309 00:51:54,390 --> 00:51:52,300 its mission like the plunk did for 1310 00:51:56,640 --> 00:51:54,400 instance and and all the data will be 1311 00:51:58,680 --> 00:51:56,650 there for people to exploit you know on 1312 00:52:00,570 --> 00:51:58,690 the US side more directly w first of 1313 00:52:02,850 --> 00:52:00,580 course we had the news of the ee s is 1314 00:52:04,460 --> 00:52:02,860 really officially it happen which is 1315 00:52:06,630 --> 00:52:04,470 awesome and double first is a good 1316 00:52:08,160 --> 00:52:06,640 complementary telescope it's going to go 1317 00:52:09,660 --> 00:52:08,170 for a small double size so it's going to 1318 00:52:11,820 --> 00:52:09,670 be higher resolution it's going to go 1319 00:52:14,970 --> 00:52:11,830 deeper in a smaller area of the sky and 1320 00:52:16,800 --> 00:52:14,980 so it will allow us to find either you 1321 00:52:18,990 --> 00:52:16,810 know the the little brothers of this the 1322 00:52:20,820 --> 00:52:19,000 small clusters that are groups of 1323 00:52:23,100 --> 00:52:20,830 clusters that are forming even you know 1324 00:52:25,200 --> 00:52:23,110 in the very early universe you know 1325 00:52:26,460 --> 00:52:25,210 above above red shifted to and maybe 1326 00:52:28,230 --> 00:52:26,470 even a little higher so that'll be 1327 00:52:30,240 --> 00:52:28,240 working together we'll see the full 1328 00:52:31,620 --> 00:52:30,250 picture of growth I was about to ask you 1329 00:52:33,810 --> 00:52:31,630 about W first because that is a 1330 00:52:34,860 --> 00:52:33,820 compliment it is also a survey telescope 1331 00:52:36,570 --> 00:52:34,870 and it's an important distinction 1332 00:52:38,310 --> 00:52:36,580 because when you think about the first 1333 00:52:39,570 --> 00:52:38,320 stars first galaxies first galaxies 1334 00:52:41,760 --> 00:52:39,580 clusters that you're talking about 1335 00:52:43,530 --> 00:52:41,770 understanding these survey telescopes 1336 00:52:45,780 --> 00:52:43,540 are going to give you more than say even 1337 00:52:47,760 --> 00:52:45,790 though jwst and telescopes like it might 1338 00:52:50,730 --> 00:52:47,770 be able to see these things it's not a 1339 00:52:53,040 --> 00:52:50,740 survey it's not the survey telescopes we 1340 00:52:54,840 --> 00:52:53,050 can't systematically look at all the 1341 00:52:56,010 --> 00:52:54,850 areas of the sky like we're talking 1342 00:52:59,250 --> 00:52:56,020 about here and that's important 1343 00:53:01,140 --> 00:52:59,260 distinction so great w first is I guess 1344 00:53:04,020 --> 00:53:01,150 go and I guess it'll be launched 1345 00:53:05,880 --> 00:53:04,030 sometime next decade but yeah this will 1346 00:53:07,590 --> 00:53:05,890 but Euclid's going to be coming up much 1347 00:53:11,580 --> 00:53:07,600 sooner so that sounds really exciting 1348 00:53:13,170 --> 00:53:11,590 okay Andrew planet is asking does all 1349 00:53:15,750 --> 00:53:13,180 the new work on dark matter and dark 1350 00:53:17,730 --> 00:53:15,760 energy and tail mentally conceiving of a 1351 00:53:20,400 --> 00:53:17,740 universe much larger than we originally 1352 00:53:20,730 --> 00:53:20,410 thought in terms of different scales of 1353 00:53:22,530 --> 00:53:20,740 the end 1354 00:53:25,530 --> 00:53:22,540 in other words does this have any effect 1355 00:53:30,090 --> 00:53:25,540 on what we perceive is the size of our 1356 00:53:35,100 --> 00:53:30,100 universe I'll let you take the kids I'm 1357 00:53:43,580 --> 00:53:35,110 hearing crickets our mind is expanding 1358 00:53:45,840 --> 00:53:43,590 right now I'd say no okay well thank you 1359 00:53:47,850 --> 00:53:45,850 it's tree it's true that the nature of 1360 00:53:50,160 --> 00:53:47,860 dark matter how much there is etc would 1361 00:53:51,930 --> 00:53:50,170 affect the evolution of the universe how 1362 00:53:54,060 --> 00:53:51,940 big it gets as a function of time but 1363 00:53:55,680 --> 00:53:54,070 this doesn't change any of what we 1364 00:53:58,770 --> 00:53:55,690 understood before about dark matter so 1365 00:54:02,250 --> 00:53:58,780 this discovery itself has has no no 1366 00:54:03,750 --> 00:54:02,260 impact on on that aspect of theory okay 1367 00:54:05,910 --> 00:54:03,760 well thank you for answering thank you 1368 00:54:08,460 --> 00:54:05,920 for stumping us Andrew as you usually do 1369 00:54:09,810 --> 00:54:08,470 on these hangouts so we a lot a lot of 1370 00:54:11,460 --> 00:54:09,820 our regular viewers I have some some 1371 00:54:16,380 --> 00:54:11,470 pretty amazing questions and sometimes I 1372 00:54:18,359 --> 00:54:16,390 just go I don't know ok well the I guess 1373 00:54:20,270 --> 00:54:18,369 if we're done with the Hubble hanging 1374 00:54:22,530 --> 00:54:20,280 out part of it I want to I'm sorry the 1375 00:54:25,200 --> 00:54:22,540 Twitter nobody's nobody's left in 1376 00:54:26,849 --> 00:54:25,210 comments and questions then I am I am I 1377 00:54:30,380 --> 00:54:26,859 have another question of course but we 1378 00:54:33,780 --> 00:54:30,390 note I'm sorry Kara out of time yes 1379 00:54:38,190 --> 00:54:33,790 absolutely all the time you get one of 1380 00:54:42,510 --> 00:54:38,200 yours you want to use it right now in 1381 00:54:46,260 --> 00:54:42,520 question I get oh my this is my 2016 1382 00:54:48,359 --> 00:54:46,270 question if we saw this a cluster very 1383 00:54:53,400 --> 00:54:48,369 similar to this one but at a closer 1384 00:54:56,550 --> 00:54:53,410 redshift how would it be different hello 1385 00:54:59,250 --> 00:54:56,560 I house do this this cluster you know as 1386 00:55:01,320 --> 00:54:59,260 it evolved oh I see this exact cluster 1387 00:55:03,840 --> 00:55:01,330 as it evolves through totality so one 1388 00:55:05,250 --> 00:55:03,850 like it right right well I like it yeah 1389 00:55:06,540 --> 00:55:05,260 we obviously can't follow this one but 1390 00:55:09,180 --> 00:55:06,550 we can find clusters that are 1391 00:55:10,980 --> 00:55:09,190 statistically consistent with evolving 1392 00:55:12,780 --> 00:55:10,990 from one into the next that we see over 1393 00:55:16,349 --> 00:55:12,790 time and as Anthony mentioned earlier 1394 00:55:18,720 --> 00:55:16,359 this cluster will grow to be you know 1395 00:55:20,640 --> 00:55:18,730 the one of the largest clusters that we 1396 00:55:21,810 --> 00:55:20,650 can see or if not the largest we can see 1397 00:55:23,580 --> 00:55:21,820 in the sky today and that's true at 1398 00:55:25,320 --> 00:55:23,590 every red shift so there are clusters 1399 00:55:27,330 --> 00:55:25,330 people have found you know at 1400 00:55:29,550 --> 00:55:27,340 intermediate red shifts that are more 1401 00:55:31,590 --> 00:55:29,560 massive than this one but I mean if you 1402 00:55:33,510 --> 00:55:31,600 if you plot the growth the expected 1403 00:55:34,320 --> 00:55:33,520 growth this cluster over time you find 1404 00:55:39,780 --> 00:55:34,330 that 1405 00:55:43,020 --> 00:55:39,790 and in fact it's consistent with growing 1406 00:55:44,610 --> 00:55:43,030 bigger and bigger and with being this 1407 00:55:46,500 --> 00:55:44,620 cluster is like a progenitor 1408 00:55:47,940 --> 00:55:46,510 statistically of all the massive 1409 00:55:50,730 --> 00:55:47,950 clusters that we have found at all 1410 00:55:54,540 --> 00:55:50,740 different redshifts cool all right thank 1411 00:55:58,710 --> 00:55:54,550 you yeah we got my question all right 1412 00:56:00,540 --> 00:55:58,720 boat well almost I guess we'll stop 1413 00:56:02,310 --> 00:56:00,550 there i want to thank you everybody for 1414 00:56:05,130 --> 00:56:02,320 watching i want to thank my guest dr. 1415 00:56:07,050 --> 00:56:05,140 doctors mark broad when anthony gonzalez 1416 00:56:09,320 --> 00:56:07,060 and mike mcdonald aw thank you guys for 1417 00:56:11,280 --> 00:56:09,330 taking the time out to share their 1418 00:56:13,530 --> 00:56:11,290 evaluations and angle that's all this 1419 00:56:14,580 --> 00:56:13,540 five this is ben and i hope that uh well 1420 00:56:16,110 --> 00:56:14,590 let me ask you this do you have any 1421 00:56:17,520 --> 00:56:16,120 follow-up work coming down the pike on 1422 00:56:19,470 --> 00:56:17,530 this i know you're working on euclid but 1423 00:56:22,830 --> 00:56:19,480 any any other observations like this 1424 00:56:25,140 --> 00:56:22,840 coming down Oh always you know Anthony 1425 00:56:26,790 --> 00:56:25,150 mentioned his student has a follow of 1426 00:56:29,070 --> 00:56:26,800 paper on the mass of this cluster that's 1427 00:56:31,170 --> 00:56:29,080 about to be resubmitted there's a paper 1428 00:56:33,030 --> 00:56:31,180 on the star formation activity in this 1429 00:56:35,340 --> 00:56:33,040 cluster that has been submitted and work 1430 00:56:37,440 --> 00:56:35,350 we're about to resubmit it soon and hint 1431 00:56:39,090 --> 00:56:37,450 it has a lot of fun activity in terms of 1432 00:56:41,640 --> 00:56:39,100 star formation and black hole activity 1433 00:56:44,280 --> 00:56:41,650 and also we have a whole other survey 1434 00:56:48,240 --> 00:56:44,290 using a I guess not so great Observatory 1435 00:56:52,350 --> 00:56:48,250 that the wise i think the control is the 1436 00:56:54,420 --> 00:56:52,360 okay observed yeah is very interesting 1437 00:56:58,500 --> 00:56:54,430 observer right yeah why is great it's 1438 00:57:00,480 --> 00:56:58,510 what i like most importantly we've 1439 00:57:03,180 --> 00:57:00,490 worked on our acronyms since I dcs to 1440 00:57:05,160 --> 00:57:03,190 okay yes the acronym is better you'll 1441 00:57:07,500 --> 00:57:05,170 like it we come back next time with the 1442 00:57:10,710 --> 00:57:07,510 wise survey we have a program called mad 1443 00:57:13,920 --> 00:57:10,720 cowz the massive and clusters of ice 1444 00:57:16,440 --> 00:57:13,930 survey that's been done you banged I and 1445 00:57:18,690 --> 00:57:16,450 so yeah that's it that's great and uh 1446 00:57:20,580 --> 00:57:18,700 like you're finding my very massive 1447 00:57:22,140 --> 00:57:20,590 clusters mad cows that are very master 1448 00:57:23,700 --> 00:57:22,150 clusters at a distance of about 7 1449 00:57:25,650 --> 00:57:23,710 billion like you're so a little bit 1450 00:57:26,970 --> 00:57:25,660 younger sorry a little bit older in the 1451 00:57:29,670 --> 00:57:26,980 state of the universe not so far away 1452 00:57:31,860 --> 00:57:29,680 but but you know a huge range of mass 1453 00:57:33,750 --> 00:57:31,870 from you know pretty wimpy to extremely 1454 00:57:35,340 --> 00:57:33,760 massive most massive seen at that red 1455 00:57:37,500 --> 00:57:35,350 shift something like two or three times 1456 00:57:40,650 --> 00:57:37,510 the mass with this one so lots of fun 1457 00:57:42,540 --> 00:57:40,660 stuff nice good well well we hope you 1458 00:57:43,740 --> 00:57:42,550 you'll we hope you haven't scared you 1459 00:57:45,900 --> 00:57:43,750 away from our hangouts and you'll join 1460 00:57:47,820 --> 00:57:45,910 us when you get some more data to talk 1461 00:57:48,130 --> 00:57:47,830 about that be be awesome to show our 1462 00:57:50,080 --> 00:57:48,140 view 1463 00:57:53,890 --> 00:57:50,090 he's okay he has mad cows so he won't 1464 00:57:58,510 --> 00:57:53,900 know the difference I can imagine first 1465 00:58:00,100 --> 00:57:58,520 one who yes all right all right well I 1466 00:58:03,370 --> 00:58:00,110 thank you thank you guys very much and 1467 00:58:07,510 --> 00:58:03,380 uh Carol we will be back next week but 1468 00:58:13,150 --> 00:58:07,520 do we have a topic yet we do okay we do 1469 00:58:18,130 --> 00:58:13,160 we do so Eric Rona is a famous object 1470 00:58:21,280 --> 00:58:18,140 that had an outburst in 1827 or 1471 00:58:23,830 --> 00:58:21,290 something like that anyway it's kind of 1472 00:58:26,380 --> 00:58:23,840 unique it's well-loved well studied and 1473 00:58:29,470 --> 00:58:26,390 there is a group that has been studying 1474 00:58:32,440 --> 00:58:29,480 and trying to find other objects like it 1475 00:58:34,570 --> 00:58:32,450 in other galaxies so we'll find out what 1476 00:58:36,910 --> 00:58:34,580 they did up next week great so we hope 1477 00:58:39,910 --> 00:58:36,920 you guys will join us next week at this 1478 00:58:41,590 --> 00:58:39,920 Hubble channel and and on behalf of 1479 00:58:42,910 --> 00:58:41,600 carol christian and scott lewis and all 1480 00:58:46,480 --> 00:58:42,920 of our guests i want to thank you all